Not logged inAmerican Welding Society Forum
Forum AWS Website Help Search Login
Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / 7010 penetration
- - By downhandonly (***) Date 07-01-2010 03:02
I'm hot filling 4"xxh pipe with 3/16" 7010hyp 5th gear and 60 (rollweld) I was just wondering if anyone knows roughly how deep into the hotpass am I digging?
Parent - - By 803056 (*****) Date 07-01-2010 21:18
Hard to tell whether you are a welder or another marketer selling another box of cereal. ;)

Best regards - Al
Parent - - By downhandonly (***) Date 07-01-2010 23:09
how many cereal manufacturers fab mudlines for drilling rigs
Parent - By up-ten (***) Date 07-02-2010 00:33
Watching the wagon tracks disappear and check how much the backside of your root is pushed thru.
Parent - - By Cactusthewelder (*****) Date 07-02-2010 02:02 Edited 07-02-2010 02:05
I would like to know who you are building mudlines for that accepts 7010 ?
Parent - By downhandonly (***) Date 07-02-2010 15:37
I just throw one pass of hippy to widen it out to boil some 3/16 7018 for the fill and cap
Parent - - By texasrigwelder (**) Date 07-02-2010 00:37
not bein rude but wat does it matter and depends were ur rod is wen ur rollin it out
Parent - By downhandonly (***) Date 07-02-2010 15:40
I dont really care, I was just bored and wondering, looks like shes digging pretty good. lol
Parent - By commonarc (**) Date 07-04-2010 01:54
yeah.....the rod type doesn't matter.  4" heavy XXH pipe.  Nothing serious running through that.  Just use a coat hanger as a filler rod Hillbilly.  Anything will do. Just burn 'er in hot and deep!  Ata boy!

God I hate what this trade has become.  No wonder oil rigs are blowing up in the Gulf and pipe lines are exploding all over Texas.
Parent - By Tyler1970 (***) Date 07-10-2010 03:20
why may i ask max range? i stay in 240 all the time. what hardnes pipe you welding?
Parent - By Tyler1970 (***) Date 07-10-2010 03:23
man put that thing in 240 range and 80 rat tail it in like you own it.! thats me at 88 ocv on a HOT day
- - By commonarc (**) Date 07-03-2010 21:15 Edited 07-03-2010 22:34
Just curious but what code are you working under, if any?  3/16" rod on 4" pipe?
It's "quality" work like this that is killing the welding trade.  Did you weld on the oil rig that blew up in the gulf?
I bet it was "hurry up and burn her in deep and hot with some 3/16 rod" on that pipe that burst on the oil rig!
Parent - - By TRC (***) Date 07-04-2010 00:59
hey common, I usally don't respond much to posts like yours but obviously you know more about runnin people down than pipe welding- Ted
Parent - - By commonarc (**) Date 07-04-2010 01:45 Edited 07-04-2010 02:43
Just wondering what CODE he was welding under.  API? ASME?  Many hillbilly hicks weld like the Chinese and Mexicans do regardless of what the CODE states. It's one reason why the welding trade is so f-ed up. Cut corners anyway you can.  What CODE was he working under?
Parent - By downhandonly (***) Date 07-04-2010 02:11
Lmao you're funny. You must have just got out of inspecter school. Ps I wouldve used 1/4" but I wanted to stay within my machines duty cycle.
Parent - By TRC (***) Date 07-04-2010 02:16
The problem your having is I don't think you know the difference between a code and a WPS
Parent - - By Cactusthewelder (*****) Date 07-04-2010 02:18 Edited 07-04-2010 02:21
I have a question for you ! Exactly which code applies to Mud lines in the Field ? Here is the Scenario...... 2am, Raining it's a*s off and you are knee deep in Oil Base. Line is under pressure and squirting mud on you. Which code would that fall under ? Another thing Mr Commonarc. Do you even know what parts of a rig fall under API ? here is a hint........theres 2 of them !
Parent - - By 803056 (*****) Date 07-04-2010 03:43 Edited 07-04-2010 04:11
I just deleted what I had typed. I decided it is wasted effort.

Refineries will explode, rigs will burn and sink, pipelines will rupture, a guy will try to hold on to refrigerators in the back of the pickup truck or hold on to the mattress on the top of the car rather than tie it down properly. It will take some time, but Darwin wins in the end.

In the mean time, the best we can hope for is someone will stop in at the local no-tel motel and give the local ladies a fighting chance to take advantage of the improved the gene pool.

Happy July 4th everyone!

Best regards - Al
Parent - - By Jim Hughes (***) Date 07-07-2010 01:27
Al,
you missed one. there will always be guys running down the interstate with a set of oxy-acetylene bottles in the back of some used up pick-up truck with the gauges on and tied down with a sun beaten rope if tied down at all and praying to God that they don't fall over in the back of the truck before I can drive past them.....:)

Jim
Parent - - By awspartb (***) Date 07-08-2010 20:57 Edited 07-08-2010 23:11
Or the idiots that can't go without a cigarette in a refinery and try and "sneak one" near the naptha crackers.  I'm so sick of working with idiots who think refinery explosions are normal, crane collaspes are just part of the job, confined space deaths are the risk you take, etc.  The only reason these things happen is people don't follow procedures and cut corners or are in a hurry or just don't CARE.  Once you've seen a death on the job caused by some ignorant, toothless, redneck, hick then you'll know what I mean. The wrecked family that this redneck loser destroyed are still suffering from his ignorant ways 10 years later.  But hey....these things are just part of the job you know.
Parent - By 522029 (***) Date 07-08-2010 23:29
The only ones on my job site sneaking around the rules are yankees, northerners or anyone north of what you would call ignorant, toothless, redneck, hick.  And some are from the west side of Europe.

Griff
Parent - By dbigkahunna (****) Date 07-08-2010 23:35
My issue is not so much with the fool on the job so much as the educated idiot that hired the fool. Most fatal accidents are not caused by a new guy on his first day. Also there will be a pattern of incidents, near misses and monor to non fatal accidents before a fatality.
Ever hear a HR person get run off because they hired a idiot?
Me either. I still believe people get into Human Resources because they are to lazy to steal.
Parent - By Cactusthewelder (*****) Date 07-09-2010 01:09
Well I'll be damned, I thought being a Redneck was a Good Thing !
Parent - - By SMTatham (**) Date 07-09-2010 09:43 Edited 07-09-2010 13:28
AWSPARTB:  I know you are a gentleman of superior breeding  than the rest of us; henceforth you will demonstrate your superior command of the Queen's english by expanding your use of adjectives such that get your point across with denigrating an entire segment of society.

Your continual use of "redneck" with negative connotation is pissing me off!!  It is inaccurate and a sign of intellectual laziness on your part to not use more precise terms.  Get with the program!
Parent - By Fritz T Katt (**) Date 07-09-2010 13:26
It would be most certainly ironic if he was a Union member, eh?

I know some of the stupid, toothless, cousin-banging rednecks around here would have a field day taking someone who said that around back of the shop...
Parent - - By DaveBoyer (*****) Date 07-04-2010 03:53
FC2002 anybody knows that. I don't work to any other code and I am damn proud of it. Hell, how often does a country boy like Me get to help write a welding code?
Parent - - By downhandonly (***) Date 07-04-2010 05:51
i use a flashlight, a mirror, and instinct to inspect the pipe I weld. and it's passed LOTS of x-rays and ut's and the like for years. so suck it commoron arc. :)
Parent - By up-ten (***) Date 07-04-2010 11:41
And that deserves a stamp!
Parent - - By 803056 (*****) Date 07-05-2010 14:52 Edited 07-05-2010 14:57
The idea is to stop the radiation from passing through the weld. I like the flashlight though. It is easier to see the "holes" when the inspection is done at night and the flashlight placed inside the pipe.

Calm down, I am just raising a little dust with you.

I have no doubt that you are a proficient welder, but you could enhance your image by using terminology that is accepted by industry rather than "hillbilly" vernacular.

Many of us that are regulars in the Forum are welders. If we are not now welding, we were at some time in our career. At some point a few of us have studied for and passed the CWI examination or an ASNT examination for NDT. Studying for the examination where a review of welding standards is part of the training is often times an eye-opening experience. The code requirements are usually based on “lessons-learned” from failures that occurred resulting in huge expense in terms of lost profits, injuries, and loss of life.

Those of us that work in the oil patch or construction should recognize the cost of these accidents. Many accidents could be easily avoided if the workers received better instruction and management followed industry safety standards.

Many of us have developed the concept that there is no such thing as a weld of little consequence. Every weld on every system plays an important role in the overall operation of the machine. When a system is down, it affects the safe operation of the entire machine directly or indirectly. Most accidents do not happen because of one minor indiscretion or failure, but by a confluence of small seemly-unconnected events. It is unnerving to discover so many accidents are associated with "quick-fixes" where industry accepted practices were circumvented in the name of "expediency."

Better communication is one-step that can be taken to minimize potential problems. How many times have you heard “I didn’t understand the immediacy of the problem because I didn’t understand what he was trying to tell me.”

One clear memory I have is of the passenger airliner that crashed a few years ago because it run out of fuel. The pilot called the radio tower, but failed to make it clear that the plane was about to run out of fuel. He asked for clearance to land, but the air traffic controller placed him in the standard rotation for landing not understanding the extent of the plane’s fuel problem.

Better communication is key to obtaining what we need. As professionals, welders and inspectors alike, it is important to use standard industry terminology for better communication. Colloquial speech might seem to set us apart from the rest, but it usually makes us look uneducated and unprofessional. The use of texting shortcuts; I place them into the "hillbilly" catergory.

Best regards - Al
Parent - - By downhandonly (***) Date 07-06-2010 02:25
Just to be clear, I'm not repairing leaking mudlines in service. I'm fabricating new ones and I'm rolling almost all of them because of proper planning on my behalf. 3/16"7018 (hot out of my rod oven) is normal to fill and cap 4"xxh or any other roll weld. How long would you last at a vessel shop burning 3/32" 7018 capping a pipe in your positioner? I regret beginning this thread because of all the confusion. a (hot fill) in pipeline terms is one pass. It comes right after the hotpass which is also one pass. when they x-ray 100% of the welds I've done in the past week (B31.3 severe,zero bead defect) and they all pass, I'll remember this ****storm and laugh to myself while I sit on my pile of paychecks and play my banjo in my sod hut next to the river. lmao ttyl :)
Parent - - By 803056 (*****) Date 07-06-2010 02:39
I think you are starting to see my point regarding clear communications.

What you just wrote makes a lot more sense and it provides a much clearer picture of what you are attempting to do.

So, if I understand correctly, you are doing a three layer weld consisting of the root bead, a hot pass (intermediate fill layer), and a final cover layer. I would also guess from your discription that you are using a slight weave technique with slight downhill progression as you roll the pipe. Correct me if I am not interpreting your description properly.

Downhill progression is a low heat process because of the high travel speed needed to keep ahead of the fluid slag. That being the case, the penetration achieved with either E7010 or E7018 using downhill progression is going to be minimal compared to uphill progression. If you are attempting to get greater penetration, use a slight uphill technique requiring a slight reduction in travel speed. Lower travel speed translates into higher heat input thus greater penetration.

Best regards - Al
Parent - - By downhandonly (***) Date 07-06-2010 03:22 Edited 07-06-2010 03:34
4"xxh is almost an inch thick so theres alot of 7018 filling. depending on if there are two factory bevels or ones I've beveled myself (I reduce the angle a bit on my beveler so I'm not filling for an hour) I'll run stringers in the fill as I'm coming up to flush and I always stringer cap to stay within the max allowable weave width.
a picture is worth 1000 words. this one is from a few winters ago but you get the idea. preheat,rod oven, max inter-pass, and the whole 9 yards.
Parent - By 803056 (*****) Date 07-06-2010 04:38
Now we're talking like professionals.

I like what I see and I like what I hear.

Best regards - Al
Parent - - By up-ten (***) Date 07-06-2010 04:40
When you say "the whole nine yards", was that describing peeling all your cable off your reels? lol.   Great pic Lee, I've seen that scene repeat itself all over this country.
Parent - - By 803056 (*****) Date 07-07-2010 02:26
It is good practice to unreel the welding leads. If left on the reel, the coil creates a strong magnetic field, the strength of which can be described as turns times amps, which acts as a choke on the current. The end result is that the machine is working harder than it should have to. The energy is wasted because a good portion of it is utilized by the solenoid and the resultant magnetic field.

It is for the same reason that when the cables are unwrapped from the reel, they should not be coiled neatly on the ground. To do so creates a strong magnetic field and wastes energy.

Just try this little experiment. Coil the welding leads around a piece of steel and hold a wrench near the end of the steel bar while someone else strikes an arc. The strength of the magnetic field is directly proportional to the number of turns in the coil and the amperage. Double the amperage and you will double the strength of the magnetic field. Double the number of turns and you will double the double the strength of the magnetic field. Double the current and the number of turns and the field strength increases by a factor of four. 

Best regards – Al
Parent - - By Cactusthewelder (*****) Date 07-07-2010 02:43
You dont even have to coil the lead on a peice of steel. Just leave them on your rells and hold a wrench near it, then get someone to strike an arc !
Parent - By 803056 (*****) Date 07-07-2010 03:03
You are correct Cactus, unless the reel is constructed from a nonferrous metal. I just used the piece of steel bar to demonstrate the relationship of amps times turns.

Best regards - Al
Parent - By Tyler1970 (***) Date 07-11-2010 23:05
i run reels on my truck, do you think this could make my selinoid go out. I know its pretty rare for one to go out. ( its what i heard).
but im try that tomorrow. if thats the case im going to make a lead rack.
Parent - By downhandonly (***) Date 07-08-2010 05:01
I'm havin fun. :)
Parent - By Jim Hughes (***) Date 07-09-2010 17:00
Wait a minute! You didn't tell us you were a CWI. :)

OH stop just kidding!!
Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / 7010 penetration

Powered by mwForum 2.29.2 © 1999-2013 Markus Wichitill