In my opinion, twenty three years as a welder made me a better and more understanding CWI. Welding experience on pipe, structural, pressure vessels, shipyards, and all the major types of NDT helps me with inspections on a regular basis!
Welding inspection and craft inspection, in general, is a different discipline than the craft itself. It helps to know the mechanics of the work, but inspection has a different set of rules.
The best advice I ever received was after I decided to become an inspector. I had welded for almost 9 years and loved to wine, dine and pipeline. A professional inspector I was working on a job with told me the if I was going to weld, weld and if I was going to inspect, inspect. It took a lot but I sold my beloved 54 SA200 and rig. I kept my blue book. I pursued inspection as my craft. It has paid off well and I have been inspecting for 17 years full time as a 3rd party inspector. Having the welding skill has allowed me to understand when someone is standing on their head making a hard weld, the weld appearance may not be exactly picture perfect. But if it meets code, its good enough. I have also learned I would rather bust a welder in testing rather than once they get on a job. Every time I have cut a welder some slack testing it has bit me.
BABRT's
I find little to disagree with above. It is of little doubt that having experience beats not having experience. I can say that 21 years ago I needed a 2nd job and was hired to go into the shipyards and perform UT thickness gaging, VT and some UT weld inspection. My boss did OJT. This became my day (part-time) job and I kept my full-time job at night. After about 2 years, an ABS Surveyor asked me while reviewing my report "You are a level II right?. My very brilliant response was "Level II what?". I quickly learned what SNT-TC-1A was and my boss sent me to UT I & II school. I came back and then went to MT & PT, I & II school and was soon certified. At that point I am performing VT, MT, PT and UT on welds, parts and structures. I have never struck an arc. I am lost sometimes but I ask millions of questions and learn alot. I read voraciously anything I can about the subject so I do not continue to look like the idiot I sometimes look like. I change jobs, get certified to do all the above by a Level III and learn RT also. At this point in time I try my hand at welding. Fair, but not gonna make as good a living welding as I will inspecting and performing QC functions. Besides (nothing against welders), I have worked production work before and I do not want to get stuck in a production position instead of one that will lead to managerial type positions. Not that the experience would not have helped, because it most certainly would. But my career did not allow time to take off inspecting to learn and get the experience as a welder. As a result, 20+ years into my QA/QC, inspection career, I am not as strong a CWI as I could be if I had taken the time. But I do have different strengths that I do not see in other CWIs sometimes. And, I know considerably more about the welding field and what is going on in a puddle than many of the "welders" that I have worked around over the years. I have put a hood on and watched hours of production welding and welder certification tests. I am able to troubleshoot some welding problems. I just cannot manipulate the rod or stinger well. I am in a situation now where I can get some experience with one process (FCAW-G) in one application (structural steel) and intend to get some time under the hood. In the future I will get to the point wherre I can be certified and add that to my resume. At least I will know if my weld looks acceptable, even if I can not inspect my own work.
All that said, I can't bake a very good chocolate cake, but I sure can tell if the person who did bake it did a good job!
I have worked with inspectors that had no welding experience and those who had experience and I would have to say that the ones with welding experience were more confindent earlier in their inspection careers than those who had no experience. I belive that having an understanding of the processes used, gives an inspector an inside track to understanding what goes wrong and why. I welded for 17 years before becoming an inspector and I know that welding gave me a tremendous understanding of what defects look like when I see them on a UT scope. Knowledge of weld preps, ID/OD mismatch, backing rings and so many other fit up related problems gives me a much better understanding of what Im seeing now as a finished product. I belive that someone who has no welding experience can still be a good inspector, but an inspector with welding experience is invalueable.
I read all the comments about welders and inspectors and couldn't help but chuckle. It took me back to my younger days when I worked in an ASME code weld shop fabricating heat ex-changers. I worked the night shift. We always had a problem with keeping an inspector there on nights for the fact no one wanted to work nights. They would hire people of the street to come in and check lay outs, inspect welds, and keep records on tests, you know inspectors work. They went through quite a few over a two year span. Funny thing was, they wouldn't take a welder and give him the chance for an advancement. They hired outside the company. Some had experiance as an inspector, but not in a code shop, keep in mind these were company inspectors not board certified. They would check lay outs and ok them and after the unit was built find out an outlet was off or pipe to short, and then here comes all of this rework ect... The ones that had welding experience didn't make near as many mistakes as the one that didn't, because they did know what to look for. I remember this one though that claimed to have all this experiance and was the worst one there. One night my supervisor ask me to do something so funny I couldn't believe he wanted me to do it. I was doing a layout and he asked me to lay it out backwards because he didn't think the guy knew how to read a print. He took the print ran another copy of it only it was like holding it up to a light and and pulling all the measurements from the backside of the paper. I did and called for inspection, he came over and put a tape on it and called it good. The supervisor was watching around the corner and looked at me as the inspector walked away. I shook my head and he stoped him and they came back and remeasured. Needless to say we had us one big donkey bar-b-que right there in my work area, the only thing missing was the sauce. It was all I could do to keep from rolling in the isle. It was a dirty trick but it did solve the problem. I have found that if you say you can do it you better prove it, or someone will. We're all going to make mistakes that's part of being a human, but knowing how to correct them I would say is the most important part of the job. I guess I said all that to ask you this. Which came first the chicken or the egg? Well I hope somebody got a chuckle out of that.
How many inspectors can pass 6-G test? They are both going to have to have some training, and I believe it's going to be a lot easier to go from welder to inspector.
I wonder what percentage of us are both. I'm both and the worst thing that I find is that when my co-workers realize that I know what it's like from both ends, everyone expects me to be sympathetic with their veiws (what irks me the most is I'm expected to sympathize with butt-stupid deviations from the specifed procedures).
Look at it this way . If a welder has the brain and the determination to succeed he will pass the CWI . The CWI allready has the brain .Thats how he has passed . Now he has to develop his physical and mental skills like hand and eye coordination to become a good welder. I have seen boys in my welding workshop passing 2G and 4G in three months rigorous training without knowing a thing about the composition of electrodes for example. Or reading a drawing for that matter. 6G is just a step away for the determined
After a discussion with an individual regarding my post below, I needed to restate it.
New Text>>> And on the other side. I have seen welders with LITTLE formal training or inspection experience, take a one week course, and pass a CWI exam.
OLD TEXT >>>>And on the other side. I have seen welders with LITTLE technical knowledge about welding, take a one week course, and pass a CWI exam.
Apparently there are a good number of welders that can pass the CWI. I'm happy to say that I'm one of the many.
Al
By jamesrodr 
Date 04-18-2007 09:26
Edited 04-18-2007 18:43
Cheers to the welders who passed the CWI with little technical knowledge and one weeks training . They are genius . They should be welding engineers hopefully after some formal training . How about challenging the CWEngg. If one week is enough for CWI then the time for CWEngg would also be quite short?
We should encourage and motivate such brilliant characters
I guess in this part of the world ( Asia ) it is mostly QA/QC technicians or engineers who take the CWI exam. The various subjects covered are substantial although maybe at a basic or medium level and it can get too much to brush up and mug up everything in six or seven days .
Anyway all the best
Hi jamesrodr
If you think some of those joint tests are easy just try a few.....funny thing is there are welders and there are some who can't simply because the lack the physical skill/dexterity neccessary to do the tougher work,....there are great welders out there who may not have the mental facility to pass the cwi exam....two different disciplines here!!
Now I personally believe any inspector no matter what type of work will be better off if he spent time on what he is inspecting.....whether your fitting, fabricating, machining or welding. The only only reason I believe that is simple...he has a more in depth knowledge. Can you be a good inspector without this experience you bet!!!.....but I think you will be a more efficient one with the experience. Just take a look at the aircraft industry and you will see some fabulous examples of this theory......guys who went and got there certs to get into inspection without spending time shooting rivets are not worth thier weight in manure.....I see them stamp LOTS of stuff that should not pass......yet inspectors who have sweated in a "hell hole", bucked there share of rivets, reskinnned an aircraft....they know how to use a scale and spot flaws visually.
For me in all reality it comes down to the "type" of person doing the work...if he is a serious fellow he will shore up his shortcomings quickly and do a quality job.....the other guys just draw a check and don't really help the company, the inspectors or the welders.
I value a quality inspector "he makes sure I stay a good welder and he protects my job!...not letting the crap go out the door"
my $.02
Tommy
HAVING BEEN OUT OF THE WELDING TRADE THE PAST 3-4 YEARS; BUT CURRENTLY WORKING MY WAY BACK TO IT, I FOUND IT VERY INTERESTING/EDUCATIONAL ALL THE ANSWERS [FACTUAL AND/OR OPINIONATED] TO THESE FORUM QUESTIONS. THOSE WHO WERE WELDERS BEFOR INSPECTORS; I HAD TO LAUGH AT SOME OF THEIR RESPONSES, BUT RESPECT THEM, ALL THE SAME. MANY REPLIES MENTIONED: THAT IF THE WELDER NEW YOU WERE A WELDER BEFORE AN INSPECTOR-HOW IT AFFECTED YOUR COMMUNICATING WITH THAT WELDER IN REGARDS TO REPAIRS AND/OR INSPECTION PROCEDURES, ETC. LIKE THE WELDER THINKING YOU SHOULD BE MORE LENIANT IF THE WELD WAS IN A TOUGH POSITION [BECAUSE YOU'VE "BEEN THERE BEFORE"] OR THAT YOU SHOULD OVER LOOK THINGS THAT AREN'T REALLY "PERTINANT" [ACCORDING TO A WELDERS OPINION] BECAUSE YOU, OF COURSE, HAVE HAD THAT SAME OPINION. ALTHOUGH, MAYBE NOT?
IN RESPONSE TO THIS TOPIC, I MOST CERTAINLY THINK BEING A **WELDER BEFORE AN INSPECTOR IS VERY BENEFICIAL, FOR ALL THE SAME REASONS MENTIONED IN THE FORUM AND THE OBVIOUS: EXPERIENCE AND EDUCATION OUTWAY EDUCATION ALONE-OR SO I BELIEVE. I'VE BEEN IN THE WELDING TRADE SINCE 1987 AND WORKED WITHIN THE PETROLLEUM INDUSTRIES, STATE & COUNTY WATER FACILITIES, BRIDGE RETROFIT/NEW CONST. PROJECTS, UNDERGROUND UTILITIES CONTRACTORS-RESID.&COMM., ETC.ETC. WELDING PIPE/STUCTUAL STEEL OF VARIOUS METALS, AS WELL AS, OF VARIOUS WELD PROCESSES AND PROCEDURES. I'VE EXPERIENCED ALL SORTS OF DIFFERENT SITUATIONS AND INTERACTIONS WITH INSPECTORS AND FOUND, MOST OFTEN, THOSE WHO WERE **WBAI WERE MORE CONFIDENT WITH THEMSELVES, BETTER COMMUNICATORS, AND SIMPLY MORE EASIER TO GET ALONG WITH. THEY MAY HAVE PERFORMED THEIR JOB BETTER TOO, ALTHO I DONT KNOW THIS FORSURE. NOTE: NO DIS-RESPECT IMPLIED ON THOSE WHO WEREN'T **WBAI.
I'M GETTING BACK IN THE TRADE AND LEANING TOWARDS "INSPECTOR" AND LOOKING INTO THE AWS CWI PROGRAM. ALL THE PROS AND CONS, YADA, YADA, YADA. THEN A THOUGHT COMES TO MIND: WILL IT TAKE AS LONG AND BE AS HARD TO EARN THE RESPECT OF MY PEERS BECOMING/BEING AN INSPECTOR AS IT WAS BECOMING/BEING A WELDER?? WILL MY WELDING BACKGROUND MAKE A DIFFERENCE? FOR WHAT IT'S WORTH, >I'VE EARNED THE RIGHT TO ASK THAT QUESTION OPENLY AND FAIRLY! OH, DID I FORGET TO MENTION "I'M A WOMAN"! :) DOES THAT MATTER? AGAIN I SAY >. YA, IT DOES. DOES IT BOTHER ME? NO, AND HASN'T SO FAR!
SO I'D LIKE TO SAY, DESPITE THE FACT THAT IT STRAYS FROM THE TOPIC IN MENTION, THIS ABOUT THAT: WANNA KNOW WHY THERE ISN'T MANY WOMEN WELDERS? BECAUSE WELDING ISN'T A WOMANS JOB! MOST WOMEN, THAT IS. IT'S NOT ONLY VERY DEMANDING AND COMPETETIVE, IT'S ALSO VERY PHYSICALLY DEMANDING. NOT TO MENTION YOU'RE WORKING IN A MANS WORLD!:} SOME WOMEN DO WELL WITH THAT, BUT MOST DON'T, AND THOSE THAT DONT, MAKE THOSE THAT DO, LOOK BAD! I'VE HAD MANY FEMALES SAY TO ME, "WOW, WELDING! THATS SUCH A COOL JOB I WANT TO DO THAT." [SHIT LIKE THAT] MY RESPONSE TO THEM, "IT'S NOT A COOL JOB-IT'S A HOT ONE!:} AND IF YOU'RE INTERESTED IN THE FIELD, I SUGGEST GOING TO SCHOOL FIRST TO SEE IF YOU EVEN "LIKE IT". IF YOU DO, EDUCATE YOURSELF ABOUT IT AND WORK HARD AT "LEARNING" IT. WELDING IS A SKILL THAT IS LEARNED, NOT JUST TAUGHT, [JUST BECAUSE YOU LIKE IT DOESNT MEAN YOU'LL BE GOOD AT IT] SO LEARN IT GOOD!:} ALL THAT ASIDE, I'LL SAY WELDING HAS BEEN A GREAT TRADE AND SOURCE OF INCOME FOR ME.
SO IN CLOSING, FOR ANYONE WHO'S MADE IT THIS FAR READING MY MOST LENGHTY REPLY:}, I WOULD LIKE TO SAY, "IN MY PARTICULAR SITUATION, I THINK BEING A **WBAI WILL DEFINITELY BE IN MY FAVOR AND WILL LEND HAND, IF DOUBTED OR QUESTIONED, OF MY KNOWLEDGE, POSITION AND/OR AUTHORITY. WOMAN OR NOT!
I LOOK FORWARD TO ANY COMMENTS OR REPLIES - THANKS FOR READING!!
I agree with Lawrence...it helps, but not totally necessary. If you understand some of the struggles of welding, you will be a better inspector because you will know where to look for problem areas while inspecting.
Here ya go plain and simple... Yes you would be a much better inspector then you allready think you are if you had a background in hands on welding! Not saying you can't be a good inspector without knowing how to weld. I also think you are a much better welder if you know how to spot a bad welds, problem areas and fix the prob so an inspector can't bust ya out.
