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Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Inspection by weld #
- - By whip (*) Date 03-11-2007 04:49
I'M QC AT A PIPE FAB SHOP BY THE TIME I ARRIVED THEY HAD A HUGE PILE OF PIPE WELDED OUT AND ALL PILED TOGETHER OUT IN THE YARD WITH NO WELD #,S ON ANY OF IT.WELD MAPPING IS IN PROGRESS AND WITH 90,S ON ONE END GOING ON BOTH ENDS ACCORDING TO THE ISO (ONLY THE FITTER KNOWS THAT) AND ALL KINDS OF LITTLE THINGS LIKE THAT) THAT AS THE INSPECTOR I CANT POSSIBLY KNOW,THE THE PIPE FORMAN WANTS ME TO GO OUT TO THE YARD AND PUT MY JOHN HENRY ON EVERY WELD CAUSE HE'S GOT THEM ALL IN HIS OFFICE HIGHLIGHTED ON HIS ISO'S. I JUST CAN'T SEEM TO EXPLAIN TO HIM WHY I CAN'T DO IT THAT WAY.ANYBODY OUT THERE KNOW WHAT I'M TALKIN ABOUT?    TRYINGTOCATCHUPINALABAMA.
Parent - By darren (***) Date 03-11-2007 09:35 Edited 03-11-2007 12:29
well you could always ask him if you should ask the customer what their solution would be. if that doesn't get his attention then maybe you should just give him the opportunity to explain it himself. i am a welder and i am sometimes at odds with qc but i would have NO RESPECT for them if they did not stand their ground and do their job. Remind him that a failure in responsibility on his part does not constitute a sufficient reason to fail in responsibility on your part.

you also say that "by the time you arrived" , does that mean you are new to this company? the old line 'i was looking for work when i got hired here, so i guess i'm still looking' might work.
if you back down now then your setting a precedent.

it was hard to get through this reply without cussing because i hate when foremen bend or break the rules to suit themselves on one hand, then, on the other hand shove them up you a** to to get a little power trip. (oops didn't make it)   
darren
Parent - - By jon20013 (*****) Date 03-11-2007 12:31 Edited 03-11-2007 12:36
Hey whip, you didn't mention the Code you're trying to inspect to?  ASME B31.3, API XXXX? 

What's the Customer's PO or Tech Spec say on this matter?  Here are 4 simple questions for the Foreman: 1). WHO welded each joint? 
2).  WAS each of the welders qualified to use the welding process?  3).  WHAT WPS was used?  4).  WHAT filler metal was used?

In my opinion, if you are working to a Code that requires any of these things, then if they cannot be PROVEN, you have a bunch of boat anchors... even if they RT clean.
Parent - - By CWI555 (*****) Date 03-11-2007 17:57
I have to agree with the boat anchors, without tracebility, your screwed.
Parent - - By Shane Feder (****) Date 03-11-2007 20:20
Love the terminology Jon, but you are dead right.
Without documentation thats about all they are worth,
Regards,
Shane
Parent - - By JTMcC (***) Date 03-11-2007 20:41
In my world, transmission pipelines, any weld made without an inspector present, is an automatic cutout.
As it should be.

JTMcC.
Parent - - By jon20013 (*****) Date 03-12-2007 00:12
Thanks Guy's.  Whip, you have a consensus from one group of experts.
Parent - - By whip (*) Date 03-12-2007 02:55
B31.1 TESTING THEM TO SEC IX. THEY GOT ME ON BOARD QUICK AS THEY COULD.I WAS DOING SHUTDOWN FOR THEM. JOB SCOPE DOES NOT SPECIFY OR DIRECT THE PIPE DEPT TO PUT THE WELD #,S ON THE PIPE THEY ARE DOING THE WELD MAPPING AS THEY SHOULD (THEY ARE FITTING THE PIPE) ALL I,VE GOT TO GO BY IS THE WELDERS STENCIL THAT'S ALL THAT IS ON THE PIPE IT'S MOSTLY SOCKET WELDS THE REST IS 4,6,10"GTAW RT.7018CAP.MY DILEMMA IS ITS ALL IN A BIG PILE LAYING FLIPPED OVER IT'S SELF ONE WAY THEN THE OTHER,WITH FIELD WELDS TO BE MADE AND LONG LENGTHS BY ISO IT IS IN PIECES SO BEHIND AS I AM I'M OUT THERE WITH MY ISO'S AND A TAPE MEASURE TRYING TO PUT WELD #'S ON EACH FIT.THERE REPLY IS SIGN EACH FIT THEN COME GET IT OFF OUR ISO THAT WE'VE GOT HIGHLIGHTED AND THEN DO YOUR INSPECTION FORMS.WHAT DO YALL THINK? AND THANKS FOR YOUR REPLYS. WHIP
Parent - By jon20013 (*****) Date 03-12-2007 11:46
Whip;

You say "MY DILEMMA IS ITS ALL IN A BIG PILE LAYING FLIPPED OVER IT'S SELF ONE WAY THEN THE OTHER,WITH FIELD WELDS TO BE MADE AND LONG LENGTHS BY ISO IT IS IN PIECES SO BEHIND AS I AM I'M OUT THERE WITH MY ISO'S AND A TAPE MEASURE TRYING TO PUT WELD #'S ON EACH FIT.THERE REPLY IS SIGN EACH FIT THEN COME GET IT OFF OUR ISO THAT WE'VE GOT HIGHLIGHTED AND THEN DO YOUR INSPECTION FORMS."

While you may, and SHOULD verify the performance qualifications of EACH welder AND the WPS that was used for the fabrication, it sounds to me like your employer has just inconvenienced you rather than anything more sinister.  Do your inspections thoroughly, if it takes more time because the spools are piled in a mumble jumble fashion, well that's not your fault...

Just make sure you take time to verify all of the welders, weld procedures and filler metals used were appropriate... By the way, how DO you intend to verify which filler metals were used???
Parent - - By new tito (***) Date 03-12-2007 14:08
I know exactly where you're coming from.  !st what I would do is ask the forman to have someone assist you in identifying each peice.....preferably someone very familiar with it that can point out to you what piece is what, which way the weld #'s should run and so on.  Explain that you try to do your job as effeciently and quickly as possible so that inspection do not hold up production, but that with what they are doing, and if no one can assist you in identification, it will take you 3 times longer than it should.

In my shop, everything is "as-built", so when piping goes on a unit I have to catch the pipe before it is taken off to get proper identification on it.  There are many times when I have been unable to identify line #'s and weld #'s because the piping has been removed and it's out in a pile in the yard.  First thing I do is grab the forman and take him out into the yard with me and start pointing at spool pieces and say "what does that go to?" 

I try to stay on top of my game, but they don't wait for me (very strong resisitance against QC).  But if there's piles of pipe in the yard and no one will help me identify it, I go to the plant manager and tell him it isn't gettin RT'd untill it's identified, and I can't identify it by myself.  No RT means no hydro, no hydro means no going back on unit, no pipe on unit means unit cant run, unit can't run means customeer can't get unit on time = lost customer!!! 

They like to play dirty sometimes and I have no problem with that, but the fact is, the longer they play in the dirt, the longer the unit sits here until inspections are completed.
Parent - - By js55 (*****) Date 03-12-2007 15:03
Jon said it best. You have a job to do. The time it takes is the time it takes. You presumably know the code and contract requirements and know what needs to be done. I would also agree with Jon in that , until demonstrated otherwise I would assume inconvenience rather than something sinister. It it begins to take more time that they anticipated, perhaps they will assist in making it a little more convenient.
Parent - - By whip (*) Date 03-13-2007 02:44
THANK'S FOR YOUR REPLYS GUYS TODAY I GOT THE CONTRACT JOB SCOPE OUT SHOWED THEM WHAT THE REQUIREMENTS SAID.THEN WENT TO THE TWO CODES IT REFERENCED SAID THAT I WOULD NOT SIGN OFF ON ANY IT UNTILL EACH FITTER WENT OUT THERE AND WENT OVER EACH PIECE BY THE ISO THAT HE FABED IT BY AND WE NUMBERED EACH WELD BY THE ISO.THEN RIGHT ON CUE TWO GUYS FROM THE MAIN OFFICE DROVE UP GOT OUT AND ASKED ME HOW IT WAS GOIN AND IF I WAS FACING ANY PARTICULAR PROBLEM BY THINGS NOT WORKING AS TO THE TIMEING OF MY START DATE SO I TOLD THEM BUT I SAID THAT EVERYONE WAS GIVING ME ALL THE HELP I NEEDED.SOON AS THEY LEFT THE GEN. FOREMEN SAID IN THE MOURNING I'LL GET THE ISO,S AND THE FITTERS AND WE WILL GET ALL CAUGHT UP.THERE WAS FILLER METAL CONTROL AND ALL THAT DOCUMENTATION WAS DONE.  SO I SAVED FACE WITH ALL THEM MAINTAINED MY INTEGRETY AT THE SAME TIME.THERE ARE STILL ALOT OF ISSUES BUT MAYBE AFTER TOMORROW I'LL BE ATLEAST TEMPORARLY CAUGHT UP AND THATS AS GOOD AS IT GETS IN THIS BUSINESS.I'LL LET YA'LL KNOW HOW IT GOES.  TRYINGTTOCATCHUPINALABAMA.       
Parent - By thcqci (***) Date 03-13-2007 14:26
Way to go Whip!
Parent - - By new tito (***) Date 03-13-2007 14:58
YOU JUST GOTTA SHOW 'EM WHO'S BOSS SOMETIMES. HAHA
Parent - By whip (*) Date 03-20-2007 02:31
My new battle is the prints on the shop floor have differant weld numbers than the prints in the office that they are tracking the piping by. My iso's have the same weld #'s as the office but but not the floor.So once again I'm trying to explain why that must happen. But all in all everyone is moving forward and trying to work together.         catchingupinalabama
Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Inspection by weld #

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