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Up Topic Welding Industry / Inspection & Qualification / Welder Qualification
- - By Shane Feder (****) Date 03-30-2007 20:12
Greetings to everyone from New Caledonia,
I have got a bottle of Johnnie Walker riding on this so hope someone can help.

ASME B31.3 Clause 328.2.3 allows the qualification of welders by others but Interpretation 15-19 appears to repudiate this statement. I am having a little bit of difficulty understanding the interpretation.

In New Zealand an ASME IX welder qualification is only valid for the company who owns the WPS that you qualified to.

In Britain it appears that people are "owning" their own qualifications which are then used as they go from job to job.

I have experienced that situation before in NZ but those welders owned their own qualified WPSs so they were allowed to qualify to their own procedures and take them to the next project.

The British welders are qualifying to the WPS of a company specifically set up to test welders, not employ them.

Any clarification would be greatly apprteciated,

Thanks and regards,
Shane
Parent - By dbigkahunna (****) Date 03-30-2007 20:35
Section IX does not say who owns the welder qualification papers. WPS and PQR's are property of the contractor. This comes to the contractor/owner on who is willing to accept whose papers. I have worked for customers who would take other companies test papers as long as they were current, was in the same process and same/similar material. (P#). I have worked for others who required testing for all new welders, regardless of other papers or documentation. If you are looking for the answer in Section IX, I do not believe it is there. I have had this fight several times over the years, and it comes down to just what the customer wants.
BABRT's
Parent - By CWI555 (*****) Date 03-31-2007 00:10
I believe the answer to this is in 31.3 04 edition Date of Issuance: April 29, 2005.

I only have access to a 1999 issue prior to this one. The 04 edition prefaces the interpretations with 19 rather than 15. So I don't have reference to the earlier version.
In say that, the paragraph you've quoted as found in the 04 edition allows the performance qualification by others provided the following:

1.) The inspector approves
2.) Same or equivalent procedure and essential variables per sect IX
3.)The employer shall obtain a copy from the previous
employer of the performance qualification test record,
showing the name of the employer, name of the welder
or welding operator, procedure identification, date of
successful qualification, and the date that the individual
last used the procedure on pressure piping.

Under those specific conditions, B31.3 will allow qualifications by others for the given paragraph you've quoted.
What you quote as going on in Britain is not consistent with 31.3
The welders do not "own' the WPS per B31.3, as the current employer must obtain a copy of the record from the previous employer, not the employee,
However;
If the British welders are using a third party group to qualify them and that company provides the prospective employer company the test records as noted in the mentioned paragraph, then the inspector would have to make the call to accept or reject, but otherwise it is allowed under the aforementioned conditions. In that, they could take
it job to job always refering to the original third party qualification agency rather than the previous employer as long as they are within an appropriate time frame.

Thats my two cents worth.

Regards,
Gerald
Parent - - By 803056 (*****) Date 03-31-2007 18:48
I just love these discussion.

I think we need a little more information Shane. You didn't tell us the category of fluid service of the system. The paragraph you cited is for "Normal" fluid service piping. The answer to your question may change if the fluid service is not normal, D, or M. One other item that may cast some light on the subject is your project specifications. There may be some additional requirements or restrictions included in the PS.

If the piping is stated to be "high pressure" the requirements for welder qualification change from what some have stated. Paragraph K328.2.3 states: "Welding performance qualification by others is not permitted." Paragraph K328.2.1(e) requires the welder's samples be mechanically tested, i.e., bend tests, rather that examined by radiography. So, a welder qualified by radiographing the test coupon or a production joint does not meet the requirements for "high pressure" piping systems.

Alway remember what the letters ASME stand for. Always. Sometimes. Maybe. Except.

So, do you get the bottle of JW?

Best regards - Al
Parent - - By Shane Feder (****) Date 04-02-2007 03:44
Hello Al,
No, I lost the bet.
In New Zealand (where we follow ASME predominantly) and Australia you will generally have to sit a welder qualification test for every job you work on unless you are in a workshop.The work is mostly B31.3 NFS and B31.1, ASME VIII or API 650.If a welder supplies a copy of a previous welder qual (even if it is still current) he will still be required to complete a welder qualification test prior to commencement.
I must admit I was never aware of the clause allowing qualification by others because all my career I had been led to believe that the WPS, PQR and WQT were all owned by the employer and were only valid while working for that company.If you had a good relationship with the employer you could usually get a photocopy of your welder qual when you left but the original was always held by the employer.
You are never too old to learn but unfortunately this has cost me a bottle of Scotch.
Thanks and regards,
Shane
Parent - By 803056 (*****) Date 04-02-2007 04:31
Hello Shane;

Each ASME code section has different requirements for welder qualification and procedure qualification that modify the requirements of Section IX. You have to read the fine print to know the requirements.

Remember what the letters ASME stand for: Always, Sometimes, Maybe, or Except. Live by them and always read the appropriate construction code as well as Section IX.

Just think of the vast number of brain cells that narrowly missed the "death train" had you won the bottle! They are sighing with relief.

Best regards - Al
Up Topic Welding Industry / Inspection & Qualification / Welder Qualification

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