We have done some work on ISO cert. As far as I know all you need is the power supplies checked out. Flowmeters ane not real critical, but the feeders need to be checked for accuracy. I would try to keep the feeders out of the ISO paperwork at least until you got an idea of how hard it is to calibrate them. I have some pretty good calibration procedures and some other infor on how to get the welders ISOed with the least trouble.

Dear pbics,
I perform audits for ICBO approved fabricators, and develop QC programs as well, and I disagree with the ISO requirement for power supply calibration for the following reasons:
1. Output at the power supply terminals is not the potential present at the welding gun, stinger, torch, etc. There is a voltage drop as power goes through the length of cables, and an even greater loss in voltage if these cables are too small, damaged or connections are not adequate.
2. When cables are coiled, which in most cases they are for storage reasons, there is a loss of current and voltage at this point as well.
3. Depending on the type of display on the power supply (digital or analog), these meters may not have a response time to give true, average arc voltage and amperage.
4. I've found that different calibration procedures have different tolerances (e.g., plus/minus 5%, 10%...)

A calibrated averaging type VOM will give the best and most accurate results when placed as close as practicable to the arc. In other words, a voltage reading at the power supply terminals will be lower than a voltage reading taken at the wire feeder contact block, or a location close to the stinger (without disturbing the welder), torch, etc. where the welding is actually taking place.

It is also much cheaper to calibrate a single meter than multiple welding power supplies.

Let me know what ISO says when you suggest this option.

I work for a canadian company that is ISO 9000. Originally Loyds wanted us to calibrate EVERYTHING including the thermistat on our consumable oven. Then they backtracked and said that because of the problems of power loss through cables etc. that this would be unneccasary. They did however insist that QA use a calibrated flowmeter for checking the gas at the nozzle end. It is my feeling that a lot of the ISO cert. process is subjective and depends highly on the ISo auditor. ie. If you think they are getting ridiculous argue your case

We are ISO certified and have approx 350 certifed welders. We have been re-certified twice since I have been here. The same issue has come up often and with different auditors. There is one major key with ISO and that is define the process. In the case of welding calibration, the welders are certified and show some proficancy (if you don't have certified welders than the issue will be training). The machines must be adjusted according to the puddle and there are several things that effect it. I highly sugesest you define the process.
Try:
1. The machines are not used in inspecting final product nor are the gages, valves etc. used to actual measure the puddle determines the output, see 4.11 of the Standard.
2. The welders have control within the parameters of the WPS.
3. bottom line the gages are not...inspection, measuring and test equipment (4.11.2a,b,c)
It is your system define it and stand firm its a system, your system. Maybe someday we will get auditors that understand what we do. Let me know if I can help.

Hello, My job title is Technical Services Manager. My job as the Senior CWI at our company is to write, test, and approve welding procedures, I am also the NDE Level III (ASNT # JM-2165) and provide training and certification to our NDE inspectors. I am also in charge of our in-house calibration department and a Lead Auditor for our in-house auditing program. We have been certified to ISO-9001-94 for 5 years. During the past five years we have had many different "external" auditors come through. They have asked and tried to require us to calibrate everything from welding machines to templates and tape measures. We were already calibrating our welding machines because of government contracts that required us to do so. The question with welding machine calibration is that The WPS has to state the variables. How do you know that you are with-in these variables unless your meters on your machine are accurate. We know that not every welder welds the same. I agree with some of the others that replied. There has to be something other than "I just look at the puddle" or " I listen to how it sounds." We use a Miller LBP-350 to calibrate the meters on our machines. This is a load bank that you can check the voltage and amperage output from the front of the machine or at the contact tip on the gun with. We check our machines once a year when we perform routine maitenance on them, unless we had to make repairs, then they are re-certified. We put a calibration sticker on the machine and our registrar audito is happy. To check our machines that have no meters, we just check to see if the dial is accurate with the output to +/- 5%, or we check them with a clamp-0n ammeter while the welder is welding (this had to be done to satisfy the Navy on a weekly basis at one of our facilities). We have 15 different facilities located in Louisiana and Texas. One last note: Don't be scared to stand your ground with the auditors and make them explain to you in simple detail why they want you to do something or why you don't comply with soething. ISO is simple, "Say What You Do and Do what What You Say". You can make it as simple or as complicated as you want. Don't write your procedures to state what you think you should be doing, just make them show what you are doing and try to make them match the standard.
Ronald Bergeron
Technical Services Manager
Bollinger Shipyards, Inc.