Does any one have a copy of a basic entry level pipe fitters test?
The outfit I am currently working for has a knack for hiring a bunch of liars.
They tell you they can fit pipe and then twenty minutes later, you find them staring at a pump riser like a deer in the head lights.
If anyone has a copy, or some good ideas for questions, let me know.
Thanks,
Austin M Finke
303-815-8267
Design Mechanical
P.S. We are Hiring pipe fitters for a long term job in Snowmass, CO
Best test to give them is a hands on. A branch test layout is a good one to try. Just give them a piece of 12" pipe and ask them to layout there saddle cut to 90 degree branch onto another 12" pipe, no actual cutting or welding needed to see if the person can fit pipe. If they can lay it out in a reasonable time then most likely they can weld it.
Tell them they can refer to Graves and see if they know what a Blue Book is.
By G.S.Crisi 
Date 05-14-2007 22:42
Edited 05-14-2007 22:46
To twobarb,
In addition to the "hands on" test suggested by ......, I recommend to ask them also a few theoretical questions and see what they answer.
Years ago, the Crane Company (does it still exist?) published a booklet titled "Piping pointers". Very good.
Unfortunately, it's not in electronic format. If you let me know your address, I can mail you a xerox copy of it.
To turbolaser,
I'm surprised at your answer. You say that if they (the pipefitters) can pass the test you've suggested, most likely they'll be able to weld it.
Here in Brazil, pipefitters don't weld and welders don't fit out piping. Looks like in the USA is different.
Giovanni S. Crisi
Sao Paulo - Brazil
Maybe this is knitpicking........
But pipe fitting is not an entry level skill...
It really isn't even an advanced level skill..
What you are talking about I think is an expert level skill.
To do that kind of work and expect defect free joints and fitups, you will need to provide a skill test *before* you hire. And pay top top dollar to get the skills to come apply.
If you are hiring "liars" thats the problem right there, a resume or somebody elses cert should not be enough to get on the payroll in the first place, and I think that's what your trying to deal with in your original post.
There are plenty of textbooks and pipefitters manuals out there... Curv-O-Mark also has materials that might be good for some kind of layout test.
My company cannot weld test someone before hire all we can do is a layout test. Only because if the applicant gets injured such as burned, debris in eyes our insurance won't cover it so it can become a legal mess if an accident occurs. But 90 percent of the pipe fitters I know can weld everything they fit.
You must know the cream of the crop then. 90% of the pipefitters that i know can fit the pipe up correctly but only about 10-20% could put a good production weld on it. Hence we hire fitters and welders. I would have to say that most of the welders could probably fit pretty well but they arent classified as fitters.
Ask the prospective fitter these questions:
What is the take out of a 6" 90 degree elbow" answer: 1 +1/2 of the nominal pipe size= 9"
How do you figure a 24" offset(center to center) using 45 degree elbows?
answer: Take the offset(24") x 1.414 =33.9" or 34 inches would be close enough. This would be the center to center length between the two 45 degree fittings.
What is the take out for an 8" -45 degree elbow?
answer: 8
4
2
1
you divide the nominal pipe size by 2, four times , then you add the second answer (4) plus the last answer(1) which gives you 5 inches, double that for two 8" 45 fittings and you get 10"
How do you figure a rolling offset? answer: Pythagorus Theorum
What is the offset of a 12 inch 90 degree elbow rolled on a 45 degree angle?
answer: any 90 degree fitting rolled on a 45 degree angle is the same take out as the fitting which gives you an answer of.................................................................................?
mhawk, please elaborate on the pythagorus theorum.
Since you asked......................:
Pythagorean Theorem
Let's build up squares on the sides of a right triangle. Pythagoras' Theorem then claims that the sum of (the areas of) two small squares equals (the area of) the big one.
In algebraic terms, a2 + b2 = c2 where c is the hypotenuse while a and b are the legs of the triangle.
The theorem is of fundamental importance in the Euclidean Geometry where it serves as a basis for the definition of distance between two points. It's so basic and well known that, I believe, anyone who took geometry classes in high school couldn't fail to remember it long after other math notions got thoroughly forgotten.
medicinehawk , very nice explanation you have always have a good way to reach out and tell us . i use it almost daily and don't even know how to describe it , thanks . good luck . willie
Mwccwi,
This is also known as the "47th Problem of Euclid", as Pythagorus numbered each of his Geometric problems. I'm sure this is something you already knew.
Respectfully, Jeffrey S. Grady
medicinehawk,
regarding the 1.1/2 nominal pipe size, what you say is true for Long Radius (LR) elbows. For Short Radius elbows, the take out is the nominal pipe size, i.e., 6 inches in your example.
So, the question should mention what type of elbow you're referring to when you ask it to the pipefitter.
Giovanni S. Crisi
You are right, I was referring to long radius 90 degree elbows.
Thanks.
Hawk
now what about the formula for 45 degree elbows, LR and SR?
If any one knows any one who is hiring in the New Hampshire or Massachusettes (US) area for an apprentice/Journeyman pipefitter, I really need work, I'm moving from Vermont and I Need a job befor I get down there, It's hard to find a Job when your looking in another state, especially when you have to keep up with your job here. I'm willing to travel, and if you know any one is interested have them e-mail me so I can send my resume my e-mail is sstkary@yahoo.com. thanks!
Mike
By Spooker
Date 04-03-2008 00:40
Edited 04-03-2008 20:43
I may be a bit late in the game to respond to this, but happened upon it so..
I would have to agree with Lawrence in: the entry level of pipefitting doesn't cover much of the spectrum as fitters go. An entery level fitter should be able to handle simple layouts with standard fittings in the three basic piping categories (butt, socket and thread). He should also know the standard math and trig functions and the the standard takeups, id/od of the common pipes, or at least where to find them (any of the trusted pocket refs.) If I were to test and "entry level" fitter I'd probably hand him a basic sketch or iso of a simple pipe system with some 45s 90s and what not and have him give me every thing I need, information wise, to produce that line. If he's competant at that, have him do the layout on some junk or spare pipe. That should give you a rough idea if he's at least entry level.
As for resources for tests try NCCER or just google "Basic Pipefitter's test". You're bound to dredge up something to help you.
And on the topic of welding/fitting our fitters don't weld unless they've passed the cert for it and usually that's just a "tack" test. Welders weld fitters fit in our company.
I don't understand ,I'v been welding for 36 years an every company make you take there welding test ,yousay that you company will not let them weld ,that makes no scent to me ,I'v worked pipeline ,power plants ,an so on sound like your company is mickey mouse!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Looks like your having the same problem i'm having. I am a shop trained pipe fitter but in the field I have zero experience. In a shop with prints mitters and sadals are nothing to me, but in the field they just say sadal this. I don't have a tool box full of templates and I prefer to layout each one. One boss I had told me he didn't make a penny unless we fit 500 inches, so we went for a 1000. Now I can get it like that in a shop, but on mt first job in the field I was supposed to tie into a sump pump and my piece came up three inches short because I used measurments another fitter gave me. I didn't last 4 days. I believe on this next opportunity I will ask to be made a 1st class helper no matter how I do on the test so I can retrain and not mess off a good job again.
I have got to ask this question. What kind of pay are you talking about for a prime candidate??? Not that I'm interested, but I am a former 1st class welder/pipe fitter. The job that I had required working with tools such as a contour marker (standard and jumbo), Wrap-a-Round, and several other choice devices that were used to layout pipe and elbows from 6" to 36". It took me two years to learn the trade from a man who performed as a pipe fitter at the Newport News Shipyard for fifteen years. When I did this work 20 years ago, it was one of the highest payed blue collar jobs in the country. To get an experienced pipe fitter today, the pay would need to be $25-$30 per hour in the south and even higher in the north east or west coast with GREAT benefits.
Whats up people! New to the forum and just want to Thank you guys in advance, for all the help you provide to people that seek more wisdom in their craft.
I know this is a welding site and since I have been asked to become more familiar with pipe fitting techniques and concepts...
One thing I noticed after rummaging thru the different threads here is that everyone seems to dance around this simple question.
"Does any one have a copy of a basic entry level pipe fitters test?"
I'd like to add to this question... Does any one have or know where to download a free copy of a basic or advanced level pipe fitters test or any kind pipe fitting test online?
The question never got answered and after doing a complete and in depth search for days online still to no avail!
Its like a top secret thing if you can't pay for it (NCCER) you can't get it!
Any help would be greatly appreciated....
I think every company usually has their own kind of test. Best thing to do would be to ask them to figure some things out on paper (offsets, takeoffs, blueprints). Arkansas plumbing test requires you to look at a blueprint and figure out how much tube/pipe, how many and what size of fittings, and so on. Some jobs I've been on require fitters, in this case tube benders, to bend tube by taking measurements from a jig and then installing the tube into it. A paper test to see how much they know and a hands on test (12 on 12 branch or 8 on 12 branch) to see if they can use what they know and what kind of work they can do.
