AESS

Date 09-10-2007 14:31

i have a small dilemma, that i hope someone can help me with. we did some rail for a job that has a lot of aess members, we gave samples for the structural welds so that we knew what was to be expected, but for the railing i could not find in any specs for the job what finished look was expected just a " it needs to look good" we did a decent job, but after installation they did not like the look of the welds. so i asked what look do you want and the reply was AESS, i said the samples given were for the structural and that this is a different situation. the end result that i am seeing is that they want me to read there minds and hope that their personal preference of a look coincides with what i think looks acceptable with the " it needs to look good" verbal instruction. i cannot find much of anything for railing finish and weld profiles anywhere in any codes or the AESS guide, any help on this if anyone has encountered a similar situation would be helpful.

thanks,
jj

By swnorris (****)

Date 09-10-2007 16:28

jj,

The AESS requirement is generated by the AISC, and rails are an exclusion, as they are not deemed as structural elements. We fabricate structural and rails. The look really depends on the location of the rails. For example, if the rails are located on stairs that will not be accessed by the general public, our weld profiles may be uniform but not ground. Our "just needs to look good" means that weld profiles need to be uniform and ground smooth, because everyone will see the rails. Think about it. What's usually the first thing you notice when you walk into a building? For me, I usually notice the rails, then the stairs, then, as I'm looking up at the ceiling at the exposed roof steel, I fall down the stairs. As I'm falling, I grab for the rail, but I end up grabbing a weld on the rail that has not been ground, and I cut my hand. The next thing is to get a lawyer and sue somebody, and that's where the fabricator gets dragged in. Well, you get the picture. It would have been adviseable to sent rail samples to the customer for approval. We still do that from time to time.

By mountainman (***)

Date 09-10-2007 18:45

thanks for the reply. i should have sent a sample ahead of time, is that usually solely the responsibility of the fabricator, or do you think the customer should play a part in relaying what they expect?

thanks
jj

By swnorris (****)

Date 09-10-2007 19:19

I think it should be stated up front in the contract documents but it rarely is. We usually find out early on whether rails will be high profile (highly visible) or not. If we're not sure what the customer wants, we make up samples and get approval. The thing about samples is that you don't want to do too good a job on the sample (i.e., finish the welds to the degree that the rail looks like it was melted and poured into a mold). This will run up your cost later on when you're in fabrication, because you'll have to make every joint look just like the sample, and that's what the customer will hold you to.

By mountainman (***)

Date 09-10-2007 21:10

great point, thanks a bunch.

regards,
jj

By DaveBoyer (*****)

Date 09-11-2007 02:51

The ones I built were made from 1 1/4" sch 40 pipe and weld fittings at the corners. These were for use outside office/retail flex space buildings and needed to "look good". I coped the joints and blended all welds smooth with a flap disk on an angle grinder. These are simple railings made of pipe, but they look like they "grew" that way. On the other hand the inside stairs at the local cancer unit have welds that are pretty nice, but not blended, but these are primarily intended as emergency exit in case of fire or elevator failure. It is good to be sure You and the customer are on the same page so to speak before You bid a job, as the grinding involved a lot of time in this case.