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Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Corten and MIG
- - By rebekah (**) Date 11-21-2007 15:09
Anyone know the proper wire to use to weld Corten steel.  My supplier is having a hard time finding the answer.  The information that I was given was a 2.5% nickle wire for optimum strength rec ER 805-Ni1, Lincoln LA-75.  Also mention for strength and colormatch: Esab Dual shield 8100w and Trimark TM 81/w.  And of course 8018 stick rod.  My supplier wasnt able to locate these but came up with 80 B 2 S and is double checking to see if that will work.

I am welding some structural supports of A36 steel inside a Corten shipping container to make a mobile lab, there will be alot of vertical ribs with ceiling braces, a v-track with a hoist running the entire length and width, some plate welded to create spaces for AC units, doors and ventilation pipes.  Colormatch is not important but strength is.  The container is 1/16" and the material is .25" so I though MIG would be easier to handle than Stick.

Any input would be appreciated.
Parent - - By aevald (*****) Date 11-21-2007 15:40 Edited 11-21-2007 15:51
Hello rebekah, since you are saying that a lot of the items that you will be attaching to the Corten will be of an A-36 grade, a 70 series filler should be more than adequate, meaning E71T-1 dualshield wire, E7018 smaw electrode, or ER 70S-3 or 6. My logic here goes something like this, matching the lesser grade of material to the Corten with a like filler will probably avoid possible cracking issues and the use of a higher grade of filler will not strengthen the welded joint beyond the base material of the A-36. Others may dissagree, however that is my opinion. Best regards, aevald
     I did find this after a bit of further googling.
Attachment: Cor-Ten.mht (32k)
Parent - - By rebekah (**) Date 11-21-2007 16:47
Thanks for the info.  I never know what to do in these situations. 
I have some people telling me that to weld COR-TEN you have to use a special filler rod (ER805-Ni1, LA-75 for strength and corrosion resistance, 8100w, 81/w for additional color match, or 8018) followed by technical reasons that make sense--the alloys of COR-TEN being copper, nickle and chromium therefore it is neccessary to weld it with a nickle bearing rod or wire of 2.5% nickle for optimum strength.
One of the people telling me this is the other welder with 20 years of experience welding.
The engineer doesnt know, he will go with whatever is rec by me or the other welder. 
The companies that used to make the w series, now only make them in large batches on demand because they arent being used much by the industry and the representatives at all the companies that my supplier spoke with said that ER 70s-6 would work fine and that using 805-Ni1 would be overkill, as it would be stronger than both base metals--also $3 more a pound and only available in 44lb spools.  My supplier, who is incredibly helpful and has experience to back up his rec, also rec the 70s-6.
Your point also makes sense because of welding the dissimilar metals, and since it will be painted, the colormatching doesnt matter in the least.

I am uncomfortable chosing between what might be technically correct from a book (ER805-Ni1) and what makes more sense in real world experience (ER70S-6).  I don't have years of experience in welding where I have the confidence to stand on my opinions.  Especially because to disregard what is recommended by the other welder, according to her, is disrespecting her experience and her seniority, which is not my intention.

I guess, with my supplier, the Hobart and the Lincoln guys all saying the same thing, plus you, I have more of a justification...

What say you?
Parent - By aevald (*****) Date 11-21-2007 17:17
Hello again rebekah, as I read the information that I pulled up on the google search that I included, I basically understood the reason for using the ER805-Ni1 was to more closely match the finished weld to the base materials in instances where the metal and weld beads would be exposed and not painted so as to provide a better color match. I also gathered through the published information that E7018 or E7016 was the suggested electrode if you were going to use the SMAW process to weld this material in thicker applications. They didn't really discuss the dissimilar aspect of welding the corten to other materials. My personal experiences with corten have generally been in the construction industry, many dumptruck boxes are lined with this material and in most instances where I have been involved, we welded these in with either E7018 or the E71T-1 dualshield wire with really good results. You will ultimately have to make a decision that works for you. Good luck, at the same time, sit down with your comrade and discuss any differences in opinion that are there and find out the reasoning and discuss all of the options, I'm sure with a little bit of diplomacy the two of you will come up with a decision that both of you can live with and by including the other welder she won't feel put out. Best regards, Allan
Parent - - By HgTX (***) Date 11-21-2007 17:33
You need to use specialized electrodes for weathering steel if you want the color match and corrosion resistance.  Presumably right at the joint to the A 36 you won't need either of those, so you can use the same filler metal you'd use for any other 50-ksi steel.  The next edition of D1.5 will add back in the 70-ksi GMAW wire to the Gr. 50W row in the filler metal table.  In fact, the ER70S-6 that you want to use is currently listed in D1.5 Table 4.2 for use with Gr. 50W steel.  (So there's a book reference on your side.)

Also, even if you do need the color match & corrosion resistance, if you have a thick weld, you only need the extra-special electrode for the cap pass.

Hg
Parent - - By rebekah (**) Date 11-21-2007 18:01
Thanks to both of you.

Having the documentation to back it up makes it alot easier.  Because she has been here so long, every takes her word as gold and if I find something contradictory, it doesnt go over well.  But it is hard to argue with MSDS sheets and D1.5 codes.  I appreciate all the help.

By the by,

My supplier that I mentioned is absolutely wonderful.  What would be a good Xmas gift to show appreciation for a weld supply shop--the owner is the one I speak with the most, but all the guys are so helpful.  What would you recommend?
Parent - - By aevald (*****) Date 11-21-2007 18:32
Hi rebekah, I just had a visit from one of our welding suppliers and he mentioned a couple of items that he typically provides to some of his accounts. He mentioned a meat,cheese, and cracker platter- that way all of the employees of the company have a chance to enjoy a little something, there is a store chain in our area called Costco (don't know if there is something similar in your area), they typically carry platters of cookies, pastries, chocolates, and other selections of palatable treats, go over pretty well with most folks. Just a few thoughts. Regards, Allan
Parent - By rebekah (**) Date 11-21-2007 20:49
Thanks again, Allan.
Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Corten and MIG

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