Not logged inAmerican Welding Society Forum
Forum AWS Website Help Search Login
Up Topic American Welding Society Services / Certifications / Welder Qualification Struggles
- - By Pete Pegram Date 10-23-2008 15:22
We find ourselves struggling to get people motivated to do well and pass their welder qualification tests.  Do you have any sort of policy for incentives for passing or punitive action for not??  If we can't get people certified we can't use them on much of our work.  I'm currently thinking that we need to reward people with money for passing and take it away if they don't.  We even have people fail the 2nd attempt after retraining and "weld coaching". 
Parent - - By Lawrence (*****) Date 10-23-2008 16:06
Pete,

Incentives for certs are good.. Layoffs for people who are unable to perform is also logical.. You are in a "business"

The people who are making you the most money are the versitile ones eh?

"Sorry Joe, i'm gonna have to send you home this week without pay. The only work we have requires the welders to be qualified.  We can give you a bit more training when you come back after your time off and see if you can turn this around, but if you don't get qualified to our standards you may need to think about driving the fork truck or an alternative arrangement elsewhere."
Parent - - By Pete Pegram Date 10-23-2008 16:43
I agree with that approach but the question becomes; how many chances do you get before it comes to that.  Some of the recent failed tests have been from "vetran" welders and some have been from "rookies".
Parent - By Kix (****) Date 11-12-2008 19:45
I like Lawrences approach to what you should do.  As for how many times they can try to pass the test, it depend on the code you are working to.  D1.1 says you can test twice and if you fail the second time you have to go somewhere and receive training and bring back proof of the training.  If you are training in house, I guess you could keep training and working with them until they pass, but that takes a lot of time and money.  If they're not union, you can wack them and put adds out for welders that are qualified in the areas you need them to be and test them when they come in.
Parent - By johnnyh (***) Date 10-27-2008 21:00
I thought Joe was a "plumber" who likes a "six-pack" every now and then.  This guy is versatile.
Parent - By Jenn (***) Date 10-23-2008 16:09
Pete,

I am a new hire/ apprentice where I am at, and there are many certifications I have to pass in a timely basis in order to be able to perform my job duties that are expected of me. Here's how it's handled.

I am hired on a contigent basis, temporary.... the first 4 weeks was through a temp agency, and there were goals they wanted me to meet during that time. I just met them. So they renewed it, for another period of time through them, but still on a contingency for another period of time, as temporary still (but with benefits beginning). During this period I will have to pass certain certifications, and be able to then do production work with reliable ammounts of passable product. If you do not make it, they do not renew your contract when it comes due.  You also get $$ each time you get renewed. It's awfully motivating. :)

I am the type that would be motivated anyway, but this system sure gives them a way to weed out the ones who aren't like me. If you know it means you could no longer have a job soon.... you might go ahead and try to pass that test. AMPLE training and knowledge is provided to make sure you are able to do so.

FWIW

Jenn
Parent - - By hogan (****) Date 10-23-2008 16:10
hello Pete,
Well, there are more than enough welders capable available in your area. If I new it was a welder motivation issue alone I would start bringing in new guys for testing. There is no need to cater to unmotivated employees. If they can hold a stinger they can push a broom. Are you sure it is a motivation issue? Is it a recent issue?
Parent - By swnorris (****) Date 10-23-2008 16:27
If they are not motivated and you have to motivate them, are they really worth keeping? You're not running a daycare.
Parent - - By Pete Pegram Date 10-23-2008 17:09
I've had a hard time finding the skill level that I need off the street.  The type of work we do requires a fabricator/welder.  It's my assumption that we have a motivation issue; it's certainly a recent issue.  I had 5 out of 6 tests fail recently. 
Parent - By bozaktwo1 (***) Date 10-23-2008 17:18
Welcome to the club!  We typically hire a guy and give him (or her) 2 chances to get through a typical cert.  The practical test we give in the interview generally weeds out the ones who are incapable.  With RT costs going up and up, we draw the line at twice.  If you can't get it through the second time, run off.  Good luck.

On a side note, it sometimes takes more than just cash to motivate a good worker.  This is a theory that I am working with right now to develop a new incentive program.  Fun stuff.
Parent - By BryonLewis (****) Date 10-23-2008 17:02
Fire them and hire me.!!! LOL
Parent - By ctacker (****) Date 10-23-2008 17:18
are you advertising in the "welfare" district?
Parent - - By welderbrent (*****) Date 10-25-2008 21:35
It's hard for me to figure out why anyone truly interested in being a craftsman at their trade would not try their best to pass a test and continue their status as "certified welders".  But in our society right now, we are not seeing a desire to be craftsmen.  Only a desire to be paid for doing nothing.  Good employees know that the only way for employers to be able to help them prosper is if they are making the employer prosper.  Good employees go out of their way to learn, speed up, maintain quality, work efficiently, work safely, etc.  How many of those do we see today? 

On the other hand,  Good employers reward good workers.  Not to get too personal, but are we actually getting back to the old discussion of "You get what you pay for" ?

Even in this employers market (more and more people available as more get laid off) if people are not rewarded, appreciated, and happy in their employment, they are not going to be motivated to excell nor produce.

Don't know enough about you, your company, your work to be critical; just wondering.

Have a Great Day,  Brent
Parent - - By Pete Pegram Date 10-27-2008 19:13
Brent,

You hit the nail on the head!  Thanks for your comments.

Pete
Parent - - By vagabond (***) Date 10-27-2008 20:29
It would be hard to add much to the above post by Brent,  I echo all of his sentiments and agree he has hit the nail on the head.  I was trained in the Alaskan oil fields by what I believe to be some of the best Craftspeople imaginable.  One of the Journeyman who trained my had welded on 2 different space shuttles FWIW.  When I was a pup 20 yrs. ago welders had respect and so did the rest of the trades,  it was an honorable ambition to seek a career as a Journeyman.  Then they took the Vo-Tech out of schools in a lot of areas,  many of our blue collar jobs have gone to Mexico and elsewhere.  We have also "dumbed down" our public schools enough to where if you can find a motivated youth that managed to get a diploma he/she still usually doesn't have a rudimentary grasp of math.  But I digress,  Pete I highly recommend a monetary incentive and it doesn't have to be a large one but there needs to be a degree of separation.  Most places will pay more for additional certs.  i.e. a guy with one cert. makes X amount. Every other cert. gains them X amount per hour.  Good hands will eventually all go where the money is.  I've said it before and I stand by it,  nobody cares how much fun it is to work for the guy who buys them beer every friday.  It's only fun until you can't make your bills.  Motivated, good people will go to where the money is and that is the bottom line.  If you do not constantly offer ways for a motivated, upwardly climbing person to better themselves within your organization they will leave.  It is a win, win situation because by contributing to their success they will most assuredly contribute to yours.  Now that I have the time with 6 months off a year I am in the process of setting up a fab shop on my property.  I will slowly start to hire and at the one year point or so they will become part owners in the company if I can get it set up like I want.  Good welders are not cheap and cheap welders are not good. . . . .
Parent - By Cumminsguy71 (*****) Date 11-08-2008 16:47
Personally I think it should be the workers goal to better themselves. I did it as a mechanic for GM, they offered incentive but my driving factor was the free education and becoming a class a mechanic through more knowledge. jAfter a few years I had experienced guys asking me questions.

Same should go for the welding. You should drive yourself to be the best. I've been driving myself pretty hard since June when I got laid off and went back to school monday night, by wednesday I had my vertical up plate done and most of the class checking out my "damn good looking cap pass". I just don't get it though, think I can still make it look better with more practice. Kinda weirded me out having people standing in the booth watching me run the filler and cap passes. Don't think I'd be a good movie star.

Maybe an incentive after the fact. Find the employees with the motivation and drive to do it because they want to better themselves and then surprise them after they do it with a .25 cent raise or something. I knew guys at the dealer that knew of the incentive program to take training, get certs and still did'nt bother unless they absolutely had to. Gotta find the self motivators.

For me, it's driving to get my overhead done, then onto burning out a couple plates for mig, been done before and on to tig and 6G. No raise, no glory, I want it for me that's how an employee should be.
Parent - By 100perpen (*) Date 11-10-2008 17:54
We have just agreed to a new labor agreement with the union. One of the proposals we put up was the welders were to maintain a skill level through annual testing. The agreement provides for 4 levels of welder pay grades. For example, if a grade 4 welder doesn't pass the grade 4 test, that welder is given 60 days to retest. If they fail that test they are bumped down to grade 3 until they can display the grade 4 skills in another 60 days.
I have started a new  round of testing about a week ago and  it is clear the motivation has returned. There were always a number people who took pride in passing their tests but now that number of people has more than doubled and I have been besieged with requests for training and testing. "Careful what you ask for "......
Not sure what the next 12- 24 months will bring but for now we will proceed down this path in the hope the heightened motivation will continue.
Up Topic American Welding Society Services / Certifications / Welder Qualification Struggles

Powered by mwForum 2.29.2 © 1999-2013 Markus Wichitill