Is anyone out there using D14.3 and D14.4 2005

Date 02-24-2009 20:48

Go ahead and post your questions Rey. See what happens, but D14.3 and D14.4 are not used as widely as D1.1 so the number of replies you get might be less than for questions on D1.1.

By kipman

Date 02-26-2009 15:46

Rey,
I can't tell for sure by your post, but it seems that maybe your shop is already using D1.1. If that is the case, WPS and welder qualification done in accordance with D1.1 meets the requirements of D14.3 and D14.4.

I used to work for an organization that did work to D1.1, D14.3, and D14.4. After analysis, we decided to continue to do all qualifications to D1.1 - it simplified managing WPSs and welders in the shop.
Mankenberg

By R McLead (**)

Date 02-27-2009 04:27

Sorry it took so long to get back

Actually the company has no written wps's and it has been quit an ordeal to try and convince them that that they are needed. The company states in there corporate design standard that it follows 14.3- 1994 soon to be changing to 2005.
The change has been brought on by the hiring of a new general manager and he is trying to change the company so it does what they say they are doing but so far it has been like pulling teeth, I am not saying he has not been supportive.
It has been a fight for every inch of gain with welding supervisors, welders, and engineering. Before starting with this company almost 15 years ago I went to night school to learn SMAW worked in construction, then hired at this company I learned GMAW, metal fabrication, machining and final quality control but I think I have had enough. To bad the economy is in the crapper but I think I will be looking anyway.
(Enough venting)
So according to B5.1 only a SCWI can develop a WPS, my understanding is prequalified joints used in a WPS is not considered developing a wps is this true or have I missed something? There are several welded joints that match mandatory Annex I 14.3-2005 prequalified joints if these are placed in proper form is that all that is needed sense it would be written. Welder qualification has been done to D1.1 unlimited thickness with the required visual inspection plus RT.
I am being directed and supervised by a quality manager and (New) engineering manager PE the joints are being designed by engineering department under his direction so I would only be recording the design and recording test results required by the standard or by him. This should not violate the code of ethics in QC1. I have worked hard to attain the welding inspector certification and want to honor the profession. I wished I worked under a SCWI or with a more experienced CWI taking and passing the certification test is only the beginning I have been trying to learn more but it is difficult when your are pretty much by yourself.

Thanks, Everyone
Rey

By ctacker (****)

Date 02-27-2009 06:36

"So according to B5.1 only a SCWI can develop a WPS,"
A SCWI Shall be able to write a WPS. any one can develop a WPS. I develop them occasionally along with PQR's.

I have only been A CWI for just over a year.
Most of my work involves ASME ,D1.X,tech pub 248( formerly MIL248) and customer specs so I cant help you with D14.3
Good luck with your endeavor, I don't have anyone except the knowledgable folks on here when I get in a bind. you will find there are many that don't mind answering questions above and beyond what you want to know.

By R McLead (**)

Date 02-27-2009 15:01 Edited 02-27-2009 15:37

This has confused me as well I will try and attach a scan of the page maybe I do not understand the use of the word develop.

Rey

Attachment: scan0044.jpg (449k)

By kipman

Date 02-27-2009 15:35

D14.3 and D14.4 do not require the involvement of an SCWI for the development of welding procedures. B5.1 is a document that lines out guidelines for the qualification of welding inspectors (with regards to Senior Welding Inspectors it is simply stating that an SWI needs to have the knowledge and experience to be able to develop WPSs) and it has nothing to do with D14.3 and D14.4.
I am a SCWI, and I have quite a bit of experience with developing WPSs. However, I am keenly aware of the limitations of my knowledge and experience. I am not a welding engineer and I am not a metallurgist. It has been my experience that in many cases the involvement of professionals with that expertise results in a WPS that achieves better quality and economic performance. This is one reason why I don't fully agree with Table 1 of B5.1 - "develop welding procedures" is too broad a statement in my opinion.
In your case (I presume your company makes earth moving or mining equipment) there are likely many joints that can be accomplished with pre-qualified WPSs. However, there may be some joints for which pre-qualified WPSs cannot be used (in order to be pre-qualified all of the requirements for pre-qualified WPSs must be met - ref for instance Method III of Section 6 and paragraph 6.1 of D14.3). This could be due to the use of base or filler materials not listed or comparable to those in the standards - a pretty common occurrence (at least based on my experience with mining equipment). Remember that the use of a pre-qualified WPS does not depend solely on the joint configuration - there are also requirements for welding process, base material, filler material, etc. If a particular joint or joints do not meet all of the pre-qualification requirements, qualification or prototype testing is required and I would recommend that you consult a welding engineer. Is that expensive? Yes, but it will likely save you money in the long run.
Mankenberg

By R McLead (**)

Date 02-27-2009 15:41

Thanks for the response and the clarification on the subject.

Rey