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Up Topic Chit-Chat & Non-Welding Discussion / Off-Topic Bar and Grill / Threats and Intimidation
- - By js55 (*****) Date 04-08-2009 12:26
Who else out there is bothered by the ever increasing word that our current Executive Administration is using threats and intimidation on states and corporations to get them to take or keep the money the fed is throwing at them?
The more the states look at the debt they will incur, the more the corporations look at the level of government interference the more they are thinking in terms of either refusing money or giving it back. But the Obama administration is having none of that and is using some of his old Chicago Political Machine tactics to try and force them to his will(not unlike his hero Roosevelt). This has also been questioned as unconstitutional. Hold on to your seats its going to be a bumpy ride.
But its logical for Obama. He has promised to balance the budget at the same time he is on Socialist Rodeo Blvd spending spree. The trick. Transfer the federal debt to state debt. The state goes bankrupt but Obama looks goooooood.
Parent - By CWI555 (*****) Date 04-08-2009 12:40
Transfer the federal debt to state debt.
States like Montana, Alaska, Texas and others are already telling them to piss off.
Parent - - By Lawrence (*****) Date 04-08-2009 12:44
I don't see what your describing as anything unusual.

Federal money has been tied to compliance for decades.

No Child Left Behind being an excellent example.

Federal monies for highways and infrastructure has been tied to compliance with clean air and other environmental regulations since the 1980's

If private business wants to refuse federal money (printed out of thin air) because they don't like the strings attached... Good for them. Taxpayers money should not be squandered on them in the first place.
Parent - By js55 (*****) Date 04-08-2009 13:48 Edited 04-08-2009 14:38
Lawrence,
You're right. Not unusual at all. Just on a much, much bigger scale.
Also, this is twice now where the constitutionality of Administration Policies have been questioned. First with the powers he is trying to acquire for the Treasury Department, and now for the strong arm tactics against corporations and states. Note, Roosevelts strong arm tactics on businesses in the 30's was questioned constitutionally as well and he was forced to back off a bit. Hmmmmm.
PS; There's a difference between 'tying to compliance' and 'intimidation and threats'
Parent - - By Mikeqc1 (****) Date 04-08-2009 16:03
Looks to me we are being set up to fail. Then the Big O will point fingers at a group who will take the heat. Just like the bonus money that no one in his administration was aware of, but then realized they knew but didn't admit to it until the news media pushed the issue .....Then they all remembered and dodd confessed (that is proof they don't care ).
Any1 can see the coming trouble that the spending spree will cause. We now have 2 types of citizens the takers and the givers, 50% of America leeches off the other half
What happens when the 50% become 75%?
Who will pick up this tab?
We will be one with the rest of the world, broke hungry and oppressed.
Parent - - By js55 (*****) Date 04-08-2009 16:42 Edited 04-08-2009 16:52
"What happens when the 50% become 75%?
Who will pick up this tab?"

This is the real fly in the Socialist ointment. Socialism needs Capitalism to beat up on. It needs the successful to portray as the devils of the world. And granted, there are plenty of 'devils' in greed that make it plausible for a great number of people. But without Capitalism the whole Socialist ideal collapses in, at best, anarchy, and at worst slave labor and abject poverty. 

Now some may say that we, here in America, won't go as far as say, Nazi Germany, the Soviet Union, or Maoist China. But I say, how do you stop it? I've yet to hear a single voice of government involvement mitigation from the far left.
And isn't a statment of such the very kind of arrogance that the left and our President accuse us of having?
The problem never was the German, the Russian, or Chinese people. How arrogant and absurd is it to say that somehow we are more intelligent and imaginative than they. The problem is the fundamental character of Socialism itself.
Parent - - By hogan (****) Date 04-08-2009 17:22 Edited 04-08-2009 18:41
The problem is the fundamental character of man itself. - Karl Marx
Parent - - By js55 (*****) Date 04-08-2009 17:24
OK. I'll agree with that.
Parent - - By hogan (****) Date 04-08-2009 18:42
I never though I would see you agree with Marx
Parent - By js55 (*****) Date 04-08-2009 20:20
I've read a little Marx, though its been awhile. And some commentaries on him. Back in my misguided liberal days. :)
Not Das Capital to be sure though. Talk about a snooze fest and way too much of a commitment. There is actually quite a lot to Marx beyond the popular, or not so popular, political stuff. You might be surprised what I agreed with. He's fascinating. And he was brilliant. But its not like Marx was the first to express such a sentiment though. I would venture to guess not even the 20,000th philosopher or writer to do so. I've always had a fondness for the German philosphers not the least of which is Hegel, of which Marx was a disciple so to speak.
Perhaps Marx, if still alive, would be concerned about his agreement with me. :) 
Parent - By norcalwelder (**) Date 04-08-2009 17:36
My history teacher said the same thing...he said it wasn't about a lack government control , or "bad businesses" but simply a lack of morality that causes economic failures. (the funny thing was he was talking about the 1890's or something, but it really does apply) Also, he draw a interesting parallel to the fact that more government regulation of business resulted in bigger problems...case in point being a man named James J. Hill who in the 1800's was a railroad tycoon. He was the dude who built the Great Northern railroad without ANY government subsidies, and when the economy crashed in 1890, his railroad was the ONLY transcontinental railroad not to go bankrupt.
Parent - By PlasmaHead2 (***) Date 04-08-2009 21:12
"Now some may say that we, here in America, won't go as far as say, Nazi Germany, the Soviet Union, or Maoist China. But I say, how do you stop it? "
Thats what the second ammendment is for. ;) :)

The shooting range I frequent has an e-mail that someone printed out about diffrent countries that banned firearms from civillians, and then the list of genocides that took place shortly after. Russia and china were both on the list.
Up Topic Chit-Chat & Non-Welding Discussion / Off-Topic Bar and Grill / Threats and Intimidation

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