6-G PIPE TEST

Date 03-11-2002 03:50

Rick,

6G is the pipe position and has the pipe fixed at a 45-degree angle from horizontal. You may need to know more than that to get ready though. since the weld procedure may vary quite a bit depending on what kind of welds will be made on the job. The test supervisor will usually go over the requirements prior to starting the test. You could have an open root with GTAW, SMAW or GMAW root pass, with fill passes made using GTAW, SMAW, GMAW or FCAW. Or a backing ring may be used and the same welding process used for the whole weld. Nominal pipe size varies from one job to another and typically is 2" or 6" NPS. Wall thickness also varies, and the examination requirements vary. If guided bend tests are performed, the test specimens will be removed from approximately the 45, 135, 225, and 315-degree positions measured around the pipe from the top or 0-degree position. You may want to keep your stops/starts out of these areas if bend tests will be used. Some companies use radiography instead of bend tests. The qualification codes are typically ASME Section IX or D1.1, but there are others. Try to find out as much as you can about the test in advance from the test supervisor or other welders that work there.

Typically the test supervisor will give you the coupons to clean up and tack into position, you will call him to inspect the tack welds and mark the top of the pipe prior to welding the root pass. When you get the root pass welded, the test supervisor will visually inspect and tell you to finish the weld if the root was acceptable. Then a final visual inspection for undercut, reinforcement height, bead appearance, complete fusion, etc. will be performed when you finish. If the weld passes final visual, the pipe will be taken down from the test stand and either bend specimens will be cut, or radiography will be performed. Whatever the results, don't argue with the test supervisor and keep a professional attitude. Even if you don't pass, you'll know more about the test and be better prepared for the next time. The codes permit retest after additional training or an immediate retest with 2 weld coupons for each failed position. But it is entirely up to the contractor which one they want to do, and entirely in their authority to not allow any retest. If you don't pass, find out what their policy is on retests. You may be able to go home, practice a bit more, then go back for a retest.

There's probably a ton of other tips that would help if you knew more about the test. I'm sure others will add their advice here also.

Good luck on the test,
Marty

By rickyc Date 03-11-2002 04:19

MARTY ,
IS THERE ANY SPECS OR REQUIREMENTS ON PENNETRATION THREW THE PIPE .... MY FATHER HAD TAKEN A PIPE TEST MANY YEARS AGO.... AND HAD FAILED IT BECAUSE HE DIDNT HOLD AT LEAST AN 1/8" PENNETRATION ON INSIDE OF PIPE .... IS THIS SOMETHING I NEED TO DO ON THIS TEST ALSO .....
I REALLY DO APPRECIATE THE HELP .....
RICK

By Seldom

Date 03-11-2002 13:38

Hi Rick,
Marty has pretty much laid out the test for you, including questions you should ask the individual supervising the test. Your depth of penetration question would be included in those questions.

There are a couple of tips I’d offer you:

1.Practice. Figure out where your body, hands, and head should be in relation to the joint around the coupon’s circumference because it will change.

2.Regardless of the welding process you’re using or the technique (stringer or weave), maintain a level (or nearly so) puddle regardless of where you’re at around the coupon’s circumference. Do not weld square to the joint! By using this technique, you allow gravity to help keep your puddle free of sag that initiates slag entrapment or lack of fusion depending on the process! You’ll understand this technique far better after your first practice coupon.

By rickyc Date 03-11-2002 14:29

PLEASE TELL ME MORE ABOUT WELDING SQUARE TO THE JOINT? I AM NOT FOLLOWING YA YET .... HELP ME OUT ....
THANKS
RICK

By Seldom

Date 03-11-2002 15:30

Well Rick, when you weld a vertical joint, your puddle (weave, motion) is horizontal which means it’s square to the joint (the joint’s up and down, your motion is side to side). With a 6G, the joint is on a 45-degree incline, if you kept your puddle square to that joint as you would with the vertical, the puddle would sag down on the lower side of the joint. Bad news! This is principle is extremely important to understand whether you use a stringer bead or weave technique. The impact of the 45-degree angle is the major reason for the higher degree of difficulty both in welding technique as well as body positioning and why the 6G position can be used in lieu of the 5G & 2G tests. Make gravity work for you instead of against you Rick. This isn’t quite so important with the root application but is certainly is with the balance of the weld.

Have a great day and go practice!

By Wildturkey (**)

Date 03-11-2002 15:58

Rick,
You are getting some good advice from the guys here. I just thought I would throw my two cents in. If you are having trouble with a weave try to run stringers. Just make shure you start from the bottom and work up. Kinda like building a brick house you always start at the bottom, this will help keep the weld from sagging. Another tip is keep the high spots down if you dont keep each pass fill uniform by the time you put your last pass on you will have high and low spots.

By rickyc Date 03-11-2002 20:16

I TALKED TO THE GUY THAT WILL BE DOING THE TESTING ..... HE IS WANTING IT ARC WELDED WITH 7018 .... HE SAID THAT THE ROOT PASS COULD BE MY CHOICE .... HAVE A TRUCK LOAD OF PIPE SCRAPS .... HEADED OUT TO MAKE PIPE ....
RICK

By stevem Date 03-13-2002 02:04

If the tester allows you to pick the process for the root pass then go with what you feel most comfortable with.I prefer GTAW myself because you can "walk the cup" and therefor have more control of your bead.If you're not familiar with GTAW then this can be a challenge in itself.There are some good posts on whether to use E6010 or E7018 for the root,back on the January and March posts.I agree with the posts of using E6010 bacause of the fast freezing of the slag but I have seen some welders that use E7018 with success.Every welder has their own preference and if you have someone letting you practice anytime then by all means PRACTICE.By practicing in the 6G position trust me you will find out quickly what works for you and what doesn't.
Is there an experienced welder at the shop behind you?If so then I would ask him for any help he can give you "hands on".(Be sure to buy him a beer or something for his help).
6G isn't the easiest test to take but people who weld pipe day in and day out can make it look like there's nothing to it.

Good luck,
stevem

By rickyc Date 03-13-2002 04:35

guys ?
how about wire welding in the root .... is that exeptible ....the shop behind the house .... is mine .... thats the problem ... no one back there any smarter than me .... as a matter a fact no one back there at all but me .... welded all day .... 6-g definetly is a pretty good deviding line on skill levels .....going to take more than one day .... thats for sure ....
this forum rules ....thanks for all the help probably have more questions ???
rick

By Wildturkey (**)

Date 03-13-2002 12:07

Rick,
I do not know if you will be allowed to use GMAW or FCAW for your root. It is hard to drag a feeder around a job site. Just remember that what ever process(es) you qualify to will be what you will use. You cannot qualify using SMAW and decide to weld GTAW.

By Dave

Date 03-13-2002 13:24

Rick,

Post your location. Maybe someone nearby would be willing to help.

Dave

By rickyc Date 03-13-2002 13:43

Dave ,
I AM LOCATED IN GRANITE CITY, ILL. ..... I THINK I AM GOING TO TRY A DIFFERENT MACHINE TODAY .... I HAVE BEEN WELDING ON A MILLER 180 SYNCROWAVE SD ... I NEVER WAS TOO IMPRESSED WITH ITS SMOOTHNESS .... GOING TO TRY AN OLD IDEAL ARC THAT I KNOW IS A NICE SUPER SMOOTH MACHINE ..... I THINK I NEED AS FEW OF HANDYCAPS AS POSSIBLE .....
RICK

By welder_guy2001 (***)

Date 03-15-2002 03:49

i think the best way to learn any kind of welding is to watch somebody who is experienced and certified. they can fill you in on the tips and pointers. for 6G pipe, there are hundreds of tips and techniques...and everybody has their own style of welding. it would be a great idea to find somebody to show you what you need to be doing. there's nothing like forming good habits the first time around. good luck!

By boilermaker (**)

Date 03-16-2002 15:25

Rick, I won't say I'm a master of 6G tests, but that's all I take for tube welding...And always keep in mind that gravity is your allie or foe...on the bottom on the starts, it's your foe, but on the top, it allows you to put more metal in for uniformity all the way around. The best way to eliminate the chance for porosity and LOF on the sides, is not to start and stop there...If you run the test in "halves" instead of quartering it, it goes much easier and faster, and by the way, looks better too. If you have the ability to run in halves, I suggest it for the simple fact that anyone could run quarter and keep moving position, but with running halves, you have to be able to be in position the whole time, which can require a lot of "dry runs" around the tube to be comfortable. As everyone else has said, do the root pass with whatever you're comfortable with. I can say without a doubt, that anyone can pass a 6G with no problems...as long as they have a grinder. When we do qualification testing on 6G for Common Arc at our Union Halls, all we get to test with is, a file, a wire brush(hand brush) and a chipping hammer. That sort of test separates the wannabe's from the welders. Regards, John

By rickyc Date 03-18-2002 18:36

John and others ,
after a week of almost solid welding , i think i can take it with ease ..... uhh..... uhh.... about the grinder ..... is that common practice ...... file out the tacks ???? or put them it "hot " ??? sounds like... back to the practice ??? my main problem ended up being ..... welding in positions that i could not see the puttle as it was forming .... just guessing it was ok .... that didnt work .... you definetly have to "think" it around there !!!! i guess i will call myself a "going-to-be"
ha ha ha .... this definetly is a deviding line on skill level .... at least i am gettting more confident .... test to be performed wendsday .... at least i had the opportunity to delay things a while ......
this is a great forum
glad to be here
Rick

By welder_guy2001 (***)

Date 03-19-2002 01:22

yes, usually a grinder is used to grind down the tacks a little so you can get penetration and good blend in w/ the rest of the bead. and after you put the root pass in, grind it down for a few reasons 1) to thin out the root so the hot pass can effectively heat treat the root pass 2) to decrease the depth of the wagon tracks so they can be burned out w/ the hot pass 3) so you can look for any pin holes in the root and commence a root repair. even using a grinder on a root pass can be an art form. grind too little and you might end up w/ some wagon tracks in your final product. grind too much and you might end up burning through your original root pass.
and yes, for most of the root pass you won't be able to see what you're doing. all you have to go by is the sound and how it feels. and when you test, most likely you won't be using your own welder...it will be the certifier's machine...and most likely, it doesn't weld like your machine at home. so it's best to get used to the sound and feel of a welding procedure before you certify.

By rickyc Date 04-06-2002 22:14

GUYS ,
AFTER A DAY WORTH OF ARC WELDING ON THE 6-G JOB ..... THE BOSS PUT ME ON A LINCON "SQUIRT WELDER " WITH 1/16 " INNERSHIELD WIRE .... HE SAID THAT THERE WAS NO ADVANTAGE TO ARC WELDING IT IN .... WERE USING NR22 SOMETHING LINCON WIRE
I WAS HESITANT ABOUT WELDING WITH IT.... AFTER ALL THE PRACTICING AT ARC WELDING ..... I WAS READY TO REALLY UTILIZE IT .... BUT ... IT SURE MAKES THINGS EASY ....IS THIS SEMI -AUTOMATIC WIRE FEEDER INNERSHIELD PROCESS DONE VERY OFTEN ON PIPE OR IS THIS GOING TO BE ANOTHER ONE OF MY SKILLS THAT IS NOT VERY MARKETABLE ..... THANKS
RICK CARTER

By welder_guy2001 (***)

Date 04-07-2002 01:24

lots of employers are using Innershield now. it's faster and you don't have to stop every so often to grab another rod. but don't lose your touch with a stick welder. in some cases you won't have access to a semi-auto feeder. and sometimes a welding procedure will specify stick welding only. just keep in mind that it's best to learn as many welding processes as possible and become proficient in them. that will ensure your employability everywhere.