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Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Stainless Steel 304 MTR Question
- - By eekpod (****) Date 11-09-2009 20:05
We purchased some stainless steel 90 degree elbows for an ornamental handrail project that won't allow the reduced section that happens when you bend a pipe in the bender, so we will weld these elbows to the handrail and grind everything flush and nice.

Normally I don't review the certs for misc jobs but I'm trying to get myself familier with different materials other than sturcural steel.

When I compare the MTR to the ASTM A304 I have a problem.  My ASTM spec calls for UNS Designation and grade designation.  My MTR's don't have either listed.

Designation says "304L/304W 1-1/4" 90 elbow LR 40S"  and "specification ANSI B 16.9-03",  then it lists the heat number, qty,heat treat and all the values for the elements, but I don't have a grade or UNS number to determine which catagory to compare it against.

Any thoughts, I guess I can't use an ASTM to check against an ANSI cert?

I'm not used to dealilng with stainless certs,  thanks  Chirs
Parent - By MMyers (**) Date 11-09-2009 21:43
I'm no genius at this, but here's by 0.005 cent.  It looks like the AISI designation is there, 304L/304W.  304L corresponds to UNS S30403.  I was not able to find a UNS on 304W, but I also didn't look very hard. 
Parent - - By DaveBoyer (*****) Date 11-10-2009 03:13
I don't do code work, but when I have welded 304 fittings to 304 pipe I used 308 electrodes. I didn't have a choice other than stick at the time.

I don't know if looks are important, but mill finish on the pipe & fittings is a long way from polished.
Parent - - By pypLynr (***) Date 11-10-2009 03:45
If I'm not mistaken , you use the grade above the designation of the pipe and/or fittings . For example ... 304ss , you would use a 304 or greater filler material up to a 316 filler . You can't use a lesser grade filler for the joining of the pipe and /or fittings . I could be off base here or in left field , but its my two cents worth . 

Um, didn't you mention that this was a handrail job ?  I don't remember  handrail fabrication going under code ? Could just be me ...
Parent - - By eekpod (****) Date 11-10-2009 16:34
thanks guy's but were getting off track a little.
You are correct it's a hand rail job and its not to any code, and yes the mill finish is WAY off from polished.

Anyway, I'm trying to get myself morte familier with the grades of stainless steel and the MTR/ certs that back them up, this way when I have a real job (other than handrail) I will be more familier with the process, grades, paperwork and such.

Mmeyers.
how did you come up with 304L is UNS-S30403?  I think your onto something and I want to figure out how you came up with that conclusion.

Chris
Parent - By MMyers (**) Date 11-10-2009 22:18
Google.  Plus I've stared at a few books looking them up.  http://www.google.com/#hl=en&source=hp&q=304l+uns&aq=f&aqi=&oq=&fp=8bd4816e1661ba1a

I'm a little fuzzy material specs because I've never been taught, just figured this out on my own, but this is the best way I can summarize it. 

-AISI-SAE only cares about chemistry (mainly for steel, not sure if it covers aluminum or other alloys systems)
-UNS only cares about chemistry (think like an updated and more complete AISI-SAE system which includes more than steel)
-ASTM cares about mechanical properties, chemistry, and shape/finish/etc.  Very complete, but one alloy can show up in many different specs just because it's a different shape. 
-Manufacturer specs which usually list things like UNS number and ASTM spec.
-And you've got contract specs, which as I'm sure you know, go are the most important because they tell you what road you follow to the paycheck. 

So if you're looking at a MTR, you've got chems and mechanicals.  Chems get compared to AISI/UNS/Manufacturer data and mechanicals get compared to ASTM/manufacturer specs. 
Parent - - By Mikeqc1 (****) Date 11-11-2009 02:00 Edited 11-11-2009 02:03
IN ASME those UNS # are listed and ASTM /ASME are usualy identical
For example if it has  (from memory) sa 479 316/316L  Bar stock i think in the Chemical table the UNS # is often listed.

Can you post the cert, then it would be better to discuss it.
Parent - - By eekpod (****) Date 11-13-2009 13:28
Sorry, it's been busy, and coulnd't find the cert right away.  Here it is.  
Thanks for your info also.

Chris
Attachment: doc20091113085832.pdf (41k)
Parent - By 803056 (*****) Date 11-13-2009 13:47
The reference to 304, 304L, 316, etc. is the AISI designation for the particular alloy, i.e., range for carbon, chrome, nickel, etc.

My suggestion would be to call the supplier or manufacturer listed on the MTR for clarification and possibly a revised MTR listing the appropriate information. Sometimes the information is provided, but the print is small and it may be located in amongst all the other information where it is difficult to find.

Best regards - Al
Parent - - By Mikeqc1 (****) Date 11-13-2009 19:22
welded seams?
Parent - - By Mikeqc1 (****) Date 11-13-2009 19:44
the grade is WP
304L uns#s30403 304 uns# s30400 
welded seam.
As found in ASME and astm is identical for the most part.
Parent - - By 803056 (*****) Date 11-13-2009 19:59
The specification is ASTM ASTM A403 / A403M - 07a Standard Specification for Wrought Austenitic Stainless Steel Piping Fittings or for ASME it would be ASME SA403 / SA403M - 07a Standard Specification for Wrought Austenitic Stainless Steel Piping Fittings.

The specification is listed to the right of the chemistry.

The file you attached says it all.

Best regards - Al
Parent - - By Mikeqc1 (****) Date 11-13-2009 20:09
expensive hand rail ill bet:)
Parent - - By Mikeqc1 (****) Date 11-13-2009 20:11
wait until you have the pleasure of checking nuc certs.
Parent - - By eekpod (****) Date 11-15-2009 02:51
thanks guys, when I get back to the office on monday, I look this back up in the ASTM book.  appreciate it, not used to working with ASME.  Yes pretty expensive handrail, oh well not my money.
Parent - By eekpod (****) Date 11-15-2009 02:57
oh now I see it, I used your link to check it.  I didn't even realize that the values to compare it against are on the top line labelled "Maxi" and the actual values are below it.  They made it easy and I didn't even pick up on that.  Because I didn't know the grade I didn't make it that far the fiorst time to see the values.  I thought "maxi" was a pad:)  thanks again.  chris
Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Stainless Steel 304 MTR Question

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