American Welding Society Forum
Sa-106 AL content?
I have checked out a few C of Cs for SA-106 gr B, I do not recall AL being reported on them.
I see on this COFC that AL is at .019 but V is not reported does this seem odd to any1?
Then I was told that if Vanadium is .000 they are not required to report it……where would they get that idea?
The Code is ASME sec VIII Div 1. (2007)
4.1 The steel shall be killed steel.
Aluminum is typically used for that.
Look to table one for the chemical requirements.
ASTM E 29 – 08
What they are saying with the vanadium is the reporting of significant digits. Table 1 of SA 106 states a maximum finite allowable value.
"1.2 This practice is intended to be used in determining
conformance with specifications when the applicable ASTM
specifications or standards make direct reference to this practice."
"3.1.3 repeatability standard deviation (sr), n—the standard
deviation of test results obtained under repeatability conditions.
3.1.4 significant digit—any of the figures 0 through 9 that is
used with its place value to denote a numerical quantity to
some desired approximation, excepting all leading zeros and
some trailing zeros in numbers not represented with a decimal
4.1.2 Absolute Method—In some fields, specification limits
of 2.5 in. max, 2.50 in. max, and 2.500 in. max are all taken to
imply the same absolute limit of exactly two and a half inches
and for purposes of determining conformance with specifications,
an observed value or a calculated value is to be compared
directly with the specified limit. Thus, any deviation, however
small, outside the specification limit signifies nonconformance
with the specifications. This will be referred to as the absolute
method, which is discussed in 5.
5. Absolute Method
5.1 Where Applicable—The absolute method applies where
it is the intent that all digits in an observed value or a calculated
value are to be considered significant for purposes of determining
conformance with specifications. Under these conditions,
the specified limits are referred to as absolute limits.
5.2 How Applied—With the absolute method, an observed
value or a calculated value is not to be rounded, but is to be
compared directly with the specified limiting value. Conformance
or nonconformance with the specification is based on this
Therefore, using the absolute method to determine acceptability, if the vanadium is .000, then there is no content, and therefore no issue.
I have seen it before. Some folks make them state .000 implicitly but those same folks have never read E 29 or E177.
I agree that it is not necessary to report something that is not there.
The aluminum content .019 it is a trace amount left from the Killing process. Enough to count as a significant unit and therefore reported in that case.
You might want to look at ASTM A 6 , Para 8.3 and 8.3.2 refering to Fine Austenitic Grain Size
I looked into that checking sol al in SA-516.
i think i think that MTR reported Al and solAL.
I will revisit it.
what do i do if in case an AI askes why was no v reported, and how do i know if its not a mistake.
On the other hand would they know better not to ask.
I was called out once by him and my boss about Nb and why it wasnt reported Cb was.
Niobium Nb and Columbium Cb ara the same element Europe uses Niobium and America uses Columbium
Al is not an element required to be reported for SA-106 material. The elements specified or limited by SA-106 are C, Mn, P, S, Si, Cr, Cu, Mo, Ni and V. SA-106 is manufactured under the general requirements of SA-530. SA-530 refers to SA-751 for performance of chemical analysis. Under SA-751, the reporting of unspecified elements is optional.
i figured it could have been a typo.
When i asked the reply was "there is no min for V" , but they did revise the C of C to read V 00
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