which wire(s)??

By jarrod risley Date 02-25-2010 02:46

I forgot to mention I am very familiar with welding all of these different materials. I know about preheats, pwht, purge, and all that stuff, but have never welded them in these configurations before. thanks in advance!

By ssbn727 (*****)

Date 02-25-2010 03:06

First off "WELDCOME TO THE WORLD'S GREATEST WELDING FORUM!!! :) :) :)"

Now that I've got that out of the way, I have a question for you Jarrod... Do you have access to the WPS/PQR's for these configurations??? I ask this because that is where you will find the appropriate filler metal(s) noted for each test... I hope this helps! ;) In any event and just out of curiosity, are these plate, or pipe or a combination of both???

Respectfully,
Henry

By jarrod risley Date 02-25-2010 14:25

No I do not have access to that informaion. These are new procedures for our company, so as of right now we do not have any procedures. The tests will be plate tests and 1/2 " thickness.

By ssbn727 (*****)

Date 02-25-2010 16:44

Well then you need to look at the contract documents and find out if there's any preference included or notes from the EOR (Engineer Of Record) and if none are listed, then the next step would be to make an RFI (Request For Information) to the EOR for clarification as to which filler metal to use...

Btw, What is the welding code or standard these qualification tests being set up to??? Is it AWS D1.?, ASME Section IX, NAVSEA/NAVSHIPS, NASA, etc.???

In other words, what I'm getting at is that you as the welder should not be left to making the decision alone in choosing which specific filler metal should be used for a qualification test if there are certain individuals up from you in the chain of command who is indeed responsible to make those decisions... So if I were you, I would follow the chain of command up to the EOR if necessary for a clarification via an RFI so that everyone is on the same page, and later on no one comes back to you and says: "You did not have the authority to decide which filler metal would be used for those qualification tests!!! You're just a welder here for cryin out loud!!!" So please take this as a piece of advice... Let the folks with the fancy titles make those types of decisions unless that is - you're one of those folks with a 'fancy-schmancy' title as well! :) :) :)

Respectfully,
Henry

By jarrod risley Date 02-25-2010 17:10

I believe all of our procedures fall under ASME sction IX. I am new to this end of things you are correct generally I am "just the welder", but I am taking on more responsibility for my employer and figuring this out is one of my latest chores. I guess what I am getting at is does the asme code book give any guidelines on this? And if so under what category?

By mightymoe (**)

Date 02-25-2010 21:52

Code book won't tell you which filler wire to use. Henry had some good advice.
One job that we're on has quite a bit of carbon steel valves to 304 ss pipe.
What should filler we use to weld them? 309? Nope, job instructions call for ernicr-3.

By js55

Date 02-25-2010 22:54

As the previous gentlemen indicated there can be a great diversity of weld materials utilized.
However, some basics are standard to start with. If you have a 2 1/4 to CS procedure you are already set. Just vary the procedure per Section IX and use the B3. Your welding Engineer should know this.
For P9 to CS acceptable choices are B7, B5, or B3.
For 2 1/4 to SS use 309 or a Ni alloy. Ni is the conservative choice and related to high temp and cycling services.
Same with 9Cr to SS.
But in the procedure qual stage you do not necessarily concern yourself with special services. If you are qualing for a job consult with the customer. If they are really conservative they may even want you to do a butter qual.

By jarrod risley Date 02-26-2010 13:02

Thank you that is right along the lines I thought. I greatly appreciate the information, and your viewpoints on this topic. I just have one more question... What is a butter qual? I hope I don't sound stupid asking that just never heard that term before. Thanks again!

By js55

Date 02-26-2010 16:23

No. No sounding stupid. This industry is way, way, way, too big for any of us not to have an elementary question.
Without looking up the definition of a buttering process is essentially, (in your case becasue there are other applications and intents of it), applying a layer of weld material to the coupon so that you can facilitate heat treat and then finish the weld with an as welded condition to protect a material from heat treat.
In this case you butter the ferritic material, P9 for example, with a (prefereably) nickel based alloy, cook it, and then finish the weld joint to the stainless steel, which doesn't require heat treat in most instances with an as welded joint.

By ssbn727 (*****)

Date 02-26-2010 17:25

C'mon Jeff!!! :( YOU CAN DO MUCH BETTER THAN THAT!!! :) :) ;) I know you can do it Jeff!!! ;) Break it down so he can really understand what you mean... In other words, put on your "educator's hat" on this time! ;)

Respectfully,
Henry

By js55

Date 02-26-2010 17:58

Henry,
Actually if I had had my educators hat on I probably wouldn't have used such terrible syntax.

By jarrod risley Date 02-26-2010 20:16

I got it, lay down some nickel rod on the 9cr or 2 cr,then stress relieve, then weld the two together to save the stainless from the pwht stresses? That seems to make some sense since generally SS isn't heat treated post weld. If I am misunderstanding let me know but that's how I interpret your statement.

By js55

Date 02-26-2010 20:20

That's exactly it.

By ssbn727 (*****)

Date 02-27-2010 19:12

Excellent interpretation Jarrod! ;)

Respectfully,
henry