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Up Topic American Welding Society Services / Certifications / ASME IX welder qualification prolongation
- - By mickdale (*) Date 03-10-2010 11:54
to sign the ASME IX welder qualifications for another 6 months do you need volumetric evidence of the welders capability?
(do you need radiographic evidence of weld quality or are visual examinations enough to comply)
any advice greatly appreciated
cheers
Mick
Parent - - By js55 (*****) Date 03-10-2010 14:23
No. You only need to have witnessed the welder using the process for which they are qualified.
Parent - - By dbigkahunna (****) Date 03-10-2010 14:48
I am not be reading IX that way as I do not see where it has to be witnessed. IX only requires a welder use the process in 6 months and it is up to the contractor to determine how it is documented.
Parent - - By js55 (*****) Date 03-10-2010 15:54
I would say you are right. I stand corrected.
I projected a practical solution but IX does not say how it is to be done.
Parent - By dbigkahunna (****) Date 03-11-2010 00:18
This is another ASME quirk. How does one document continuity? When I review or aduit a contractors welding procedures and welder qualification I have yet to see where continuity is documented other than the QC person says the welder was working in that process. I have to accept this as fact. And in the last few years I have found if the contractor has gone to the trouble to set up a QC program, it is a pretty safe bet they are keeping up with continuity.
Pipeline welder qualification under 1104 are another thing.
Parent - - By Shane Feder (****) Date 03-11-2010 00:20
Hi guys,
Based on QW 322.1 (1) I would say it must be witnessed

QW-322 Expiration and Renewal of Qualification
QW-322.1 Expiration of Qualification. The performance
qualification of a welder or welding operator shall be
affected when one of the following conditions occurs:
(a) When he has not welded with a process during a
period of 6 months or more, his qualification for that process
shall expire; unless, within the 6 month period, prior
to his expiration of qualification
(1) the welder has welded with that process using
manual or semiautomatic welding, under the supervision
and control of the qualifying manufacturer or contractor
or participating organization(s) as identified in QW-300.3;
that will extend his qualification for an additional 6 months

Regards,
Shane
Parent - - By jon20013 (*****) Date 03-11-2010 11:57
Shane, I hear you and wish I could agree, but I believe the others are correct.  That said, when it comes to "proving it" if it isn't somehow documented it wouldn't hold water if I were doing the auditing.  There is no requirement for volumetric, in fact one bead in flat position will keep the process current (crazy, I know).  In Kazakhstan, our QC require a minimum of 2 volumetric examinations during the 6 month period and I personally think its a good idea, but it's not code stuff.
Parent - - By Shane Feder (****) Date 03-12-2010 00:29
Hi Jon,
Welcome back.
The original question was "Is volumetric testing required ?" and Jeff responded that it only had to be witnessed.
dbigkahunna queried the requirement to actually witness the welder welding and that was what I was responding to.
If the welder has to have used a process "...under the supervision and control of the qualifying manufacturer or contractor...." then it would have to have been witnessed.
Regards,
Shane
Parent - - By dbigkahunna (****) Date 03-12-2010 13:45
The issue is define "...under the supervision and control..."
IX does not define this. You may read this to mean someone has to actually see the test done. If the contractor hands the welder a plate and tells them to run a bead, ss that under the supervision and control?
Most contractors who have a decent QC program will have a way to supervise and control continuity. But I have seen QC manuals that say nothing more than the welder must weld in the process every 6 months.
Want to take a bet between the two who will have generally better welders?
This is another thing that keeps us employed.
Parent - - By mickdale (*) Date 03-13-2010 09:56
thanks for all the help

We have a detailed log of every radiographed weld in our system but i looked through it and found a couple of welders didnt have inputs for one of the processes they are qualified for.
Each weld they lay is visually inspected, but we dont have a specific document to record this, that i can easily use to prove to an auditor if they were to ask.
I dont feel comfortable signing an ASME IX welders prolongation without written records to back me up (even though i know they have welded in that process and passed visual and hydraulic testing).

I will add documentation to address this

Once again, thanks
Mick Dale
Parent - - By js55 (*****) Date 03-13-2010 18:39
If an auditor were to ask (and I have NEVER known this to happen) it would not conclude with a finding, only a recommendation (some auditors love these things when they can't find anything else and need to justify their job-you will not get this from good auditors) , since there is no requirement that you back up a certified continuity record with what is perhaps a less robust form. The logic of it is even suspect. I have never had an auditor ask that question so you might consider this before you go restricting yourself to something that is NOT required.
Going beyond basic requirements is not a bad philosophy but only when it adds something to your product or process.
I would say this doesn't add anything but another layer of required document. In other words, a document for docuement sake.
Now, if you add it to your system it does become auditable.
Parent - - By dbigkahunna (****) Date 03-14-2010 05:38
Golden Words!
And once it is added, it stays, and stays and stays and...........
Parent - By js55 (*****) Date 03-15-2010 12:51
Oh yeah!!
Once you identify your revs the question will always be asked, "Why did you stop doing this?"
And, "Because it was a pain in the azz." is not an acceptable answer.
Up Topic American Welding Society Services / Certifications / ASME IX welder qualification prolongation

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