Flux-core Wire-feed versus Stick welder?

Date 07-08-2002 14:49

Semi-automatic welding is not just pushing a button on a toarch ... this is a mis-conception of many people. It is more difficult to weld with GMAW / FCAW then stick electrode ! Weld defects (lack of fusion and incomplete penetration) are common with semi-automatic welding.
With stick electrode you'll have more control on the weld pool.
Start with rutile type electrodes E6016 for mild steel.

By DaveSisk (**)

Date 07-08-2002 19:12

Hey Tim:

So, sounds like you're saying that it's more difficult to "strike an arc" with a stick welder, but once you have that mastered, it's easier to get a good weld (good meaning better penetration, neater weld, less splatter, etc?) with a stick welder. Getting an arc is easier with a wire-feed welder, but actually getting a good weld is harder. Did I interpret this correctly?

Thanks for the answers!
Dave

By DaveSisk (**)

Date 07-08-2002 19:17

Tim:

Would an inexpensive unit like this one be a good choice to give stick welding a try with? It's appealing because 1) it's inexpensive, and 2) it can be run off 110V (which I already have, of course) or 220V (which I can have run if I'm able to learn this). What do you think?

[url]http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=40388[/url]

One more question: with my little self-shielding flux-cored wire feed welder, I can only weld mild steel. Are there stick-welder electrodes for welding other materials, such as aluminum? Or can aluminum really only be done with a MIG setup?

Regards,
Dave

By GRoberts (***)

Date 07-08-2002 20:58

What you might consider is getting a gas shielding kit to go with your welder. Then you can use your welder to weld carbon steel, stainless steel, possibly aluminum (I've never tried), and other metals as long as you can find a .035 or smaller FCAW wire or .030 or smaller solid wire. The gas shielded wires also run quite a bit nicer. Less spatter, less smoke, eisier chipping slag, and a nicer looking bead. This of course also depends on which gas sheilded FCAW wire you choose too.

By Niekie3 (***)

Date 07-08-2002 19:53

Hi Dave

I think your real problem seems to be the spatter and weld appearance. Weld spatter is a typical problem with self-shielded FCAW. This problem is worse on some wires than others, so selecting the right wire can improve matters. None the less, if you want good looking welds with FCAW, use gas assisted.

In addition, it is important to use the correct polarity, voltage and wire feed speed for your particular wire. Are you following the manufacturer's recomendations?

Regarding the use of SMAW, (Stick) it is not generally true that you will have better penetration. FCAW in general has very good penetration. (Unlike GMAW in dip-transfer.)

It is my opinion that if you use a good quality wire with the correct settings, you will end up with about the same amount of spatter in FCAW as with SMAW for the same volume of weld metal deposited. Each run of FCAW may give more spatter than a run of SMAW, but the deposition rates are generally higher per run with FCAW than SMAW.

Regarding the difficulty of using SMAW, I can only say that it will depend very much on yourself. Some people take better to some processes than others. It is however safe to say that when using a general purpose electrode such as E6013, SMAW is not that hard to learn to use for "hobby" quality welds.

Regards
Niekie Jooste

By Steve 3884 (*)

Date 07-09-2002 17:37

Hi Dave,
There is one thing I don't beleive anyone has mentioned regarding the spatter you experience with your open arc wire. The voltage is directly related to the wire stick-out. The longer the arc, the higher the voltage. The higher the voltage, the more spatter and the less penetration.

There is a difference in wire quality. Sometimes substantial. Keep in mind that the wire type you have is also susceptible to moisture pick-up. Another source of excess spatter and a host of other detrimental effects on weld quality.

The small welders like yours aren't going to give the best results with the flux cored wires. The best you can do is to know the wire manufacturers parameters and adjust the machine as closely as possible to them. Especially if the wire is a "TGS" designation.

Regarding the SMAW vs. FCAW question: Both processes have there inherent benefits and shortcomings. Probably the biggest single difference is in the way the consumables are marketed. If you weld several different types of metals but not in any specific large quantity, the wire welder may not be practical. I general, flux cored wires come in limited selection regarding metal type. With gas shielded wire, quantities are preset by spool size. You may have to purchase 25# or more of a wire you don't use very often. (Cast iron welding alloy for instance.) You may also be required to keep several different gas mixtures on hand. IMHO, a small SMAW machine is much more versatile and the best choice for all around repair welding. A wire welder shines where fabrication or repair of one or two specific metal types is predominant or thin material is often the order of the day.

If I could add one more thing it would be to say that "you generally get what you pay for in welding equipment of any sort." There are a number of ways to cheapen both electrodes and machines.
HTH,
Steve

By dasimonds (**)

Date 08-03-2002 12:15

Hi Dave,
Bumpy welds usually indicate an inconsistent travel speed. You would get the same bumpy appearence with stick welding if you have an inconsistent travel speed. You might try a gas shielded FCAW wire, but if the machine is set incorrectly, you'll still get a bumpy weld with lots of spatter. Try turning down your wire speed on the feeder and see what happens with the spatter. I've also seen times where too little wire speed gives excessive spatter. Best advice; play around with it.
Hope this helps
Dale Simonds