Hey everyone, I was wondering if i'm the only one that deals with these situations, I am the CWI/QC Manager at a small structural steel fabrication shop
Example 1 - we have three beams with clips to be welded on both sides, the guy makes the fits and i check them, then i walk off and the President walks up to the guy and tells him to just weld them with hard wire (gmaw) and that would be alright, no big deal ( we have no WPS for GMAW ). The guy told me about it and i'm like what the $@#, he's the prez.
Example 2 - we have a w16@89 beam with clips, stiffeners, and wing plates for a power co., the prints have no weld symbols, i ask for the contact to call about them, the answer i got was ( the prez said just weld with 5/16" fillet on all, some of the freaking plates are 1/4" ) you know, im bout to give up.
just wondering if im the only one that deals with $#@ like this
Strat
Can you write a WPS for a GMAW fillet weld and keep it in the file for the next time the Prez makes a choice to do his own thing?...and don't forget to qualify the welder too.
I just make notes in my reports of any deviences from the norm if I get overridden on something that is not quite up to par. Hopefully you can get the management to buy into the quality aspect, or it's going to be a hard row for you to hoe. I think we have all ran up on situations that make us pull our hair out, similar to yours.
John,
im going to write a WPS and test out the welder(s) on GMAW like you stateded just for this situation, you know, I probly shouldnt make statements like that on here for im sure we've all been through this, I just wonted to vent and theres no one here to vent to except the prez.
I understand the venting...I've used Chet and others here in the past as a sounding board. Hopefully these events won't be a typical occurance and you can retain some of your sanity. But just keep in mind that rare occurances of this is not out of the norm, and I'm sure other QC folk will agree to some extent, if they are honest. Chet reminded me of something many years back that it takes a few miles of ocean to turn one of these large ships around, so be patient and pick your battles wisely and keep promoting the fact that quality work doesn't cost any more to do it right the first time around. Good Luck.
You don't get any third party inspectors in there?
On bigger jobs we do, Duke
This situation was on two diff. small jobs
Strat,
I'm going to ask this because I TRY not to ASSUME certain things: Your GMAW is set and run for Spray Transfer, not Short Circuit? Otherwise you can't use it even with a WPS and welders Certs.
While, at least to me, 5/16 fillets sounds large for 1/4" plates, if you only have a small number to do that would probably be okay. But I'm like you, I like to hear it from the engineer. Weld size is their job. Mine is only to make sure it is met. And if a TPI is going to be double checking you at any point they are going to ask where the RFI is stating weld size for the joint in question. Why not get it done at the beginning of the job? Only takes a few minutes. Better than adding weld later. Cheaper than putting too much weld on and having to grind it down because now the other parts won't bolt up due to weld interference.
Lastly, John is right, document it in your reports. At least you have done your proper job and protected yourself. Not your job to stop things. Just document QC. If the boss wants it done different, let the customer be the final decision maker as to rather or not it meets his QC.
Have a Great Day, Brent
By 803056 
Date 10-11-2010 16:29
Edited 10-11-2010 16:42
Maybe I'm just stupit, but how ya guna make a 5/16 inch weld ona 1/4 plate? Oh yea, it's a stifner that 1/4 inch thick. Now I untersant.
All kidding aside, if the material is A36 and if the fillet welds are on both sides of the piece (not applicable to lap joints), the 5/16 inch fillet weld makes sense. The throat of the single fillet weld is 0.22 inches, slightly less than the thickness of the stiffener. The allowable stress on the fillet, based on the tensile strength of the filler metal, cannot exceed 0.4 times the yield (15 ksi) nor 0.6 times the tensile strength (34.8 ksi) of the base metal. The allowable stress on the weld is 0.3 times the tensile strength or about 21 ksi, so the yield strength of the base metal governs. The size of the fillet weld is overkill, but at least it isn't the weak link.
As for the GMAW, remember the boss may not be right, but he is never wrong. Not very helpful, but what can you do?
Al
