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Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Seeing double with gold lens
- - By strother (***) Date 12-31-2010 02:50
I bought a new #10 gold lens not long ago . I don't remember the brand nothing expensive probably just whatever generic Praxair sells. I put it in my hood and with new clear lenses and everything is fine. Then I start to notice that I can see two arcs . The second one is not as bright but it bugs the crap out of me. The dirtier the clear lenses get the less I notice the second arc ,but by the time it goes away it's time to change the clear lenses. Any suggestions?
Parent - By weldaboy (**) Date 12-31-2010 03:48
change ur filter lens. i had one do that one time so i took it out and looked it over and it had a tiny little spot where the gold had flaked off right where i looked through it. it bugged the crap outta me 2.
Parent - - By rlitman (***) Date 12-31-2010 03:49
Is there a gap between the front clear lens, and the gold surface?  Sounds like the light is reflecting off the gold onto the back of the clear lens, and back to you.
Parent - - By rcwelding (***) Date 12-31-2010 04:27
I like a Red lens but I had the same problem... Tried different lenses and it never went away... Finally said heck with it... Went back to my green lenses... No more problems..!!

RC
Parent - - By TozziWelding (**) Date 12-31-2010 12:13
Try a fresh cover, if I have to wear safety glasses under my hood that does it too.
Parent - By rcwelding (***) Date 12-31-2010 16:39
I always wear safety glasses... I doesn't do it with any other lenses just the Red lenses..  I have changed everything out and I still get it...

  RC
Parent - By burleigh26 (**) Date 12-31-2010 15:03
I had the same problem with 3 in a row. changed the filter lens, no difference so bought a new gold. got the same problem again, now use the auto darks and have no problems. like you said, i couldnt stand it either and thought it was my eyes, i never could figure it out.
- - By crahner (**) Date 12-31-2010 12:50
I have had the same problem with the plastic lenses, but never with the glass.
Parent - - By Robert48 (**) Date 12-31-2010 16:30
I have a nex-gen that does the same thing. It is always there but I don't always notice it. But when you do you can't stop looking at it .
Parent - - By 803056 (*****) Date 12-31-2010 18:35
I've had a similar problems on several occasions. It was usually because the filter and cover plates were not seated so they were parallel to each other. A slight angle of one to the other will cause some of the light to be reflected off one lens and then off the other resulting in two images as you look through the helmet.

Check the helmet to make sure the gaskets are not askew and both the cover and fileter plates are seated properly.

Best regards - Al
Parent - - By Tommyjoking (****) Date 12-31-2010 22:55
I agree with AL  I have had the double vision problem before and is always seemed to be a problem between the cover plate and lens.  The closer they are to each other the better(gasket what have you).   I run a cover plate on the backside in my mig and stick hoods so that kinda causes double jeopardy...if they are not flat against each other I get the double vision problem.  If I run too light a shade I get a reflection problem with my glasses as well.

off subject a bit but I gave a kid a glass gold filter plate and he was gratefull but asked me why it was green.....I checked it and sure enough it was green.   Every gold lens I have ever used was red or "true color"....I did not know you could buy green gold lenses.  Do not know what brand it was ...will check for label Monday.
Parent - - By DaveBoyer (*****) Date 01-01-2011 04:49
I am waiting for Scott Norris to give a humorous explanatin for seeing double...
Parent - By Lawrence (*****) Date 01-01-2011 15:16
Close one eye

Problem solved
Parent - - By rcwelding (***) Date 12-31-2010 23:42
If I made the two lenses touch each other it got better but the clear lens would wind up scratching the Gold lens after a while so I just went to a green glass lens and haven't looked back..  Never tried a red glass lens..

  RC
Parent - - By Chris2626 (***) Date 01-01-2011 00:28
I had this same problem using my Jackson nex-gen auto dark so this is why I stopped using it and went back to a glass lense I agree sometims i have this still on a certain angle but not to often. I say stay with the gold lense there dam clearer then anything else, I won't go to a auto dark and will stay with a philips safety lense till the day I die thanks to Henry there some dam good leses
Parent - By mcostello (**) Date 01-01-2011 02:50
I have heard of people "seeing the light", but, never heard of anyone seeing it twice! :)
Parent - By rlitman (***) Date 01-01-2011 16:41
Ok.  Since you don't want any scratches on the gold lens, then you need a gap, but if the gap is small enough, it should minimize the double vision.
I would wrap the edges of the gold lens in electrical tape (the scotch 33 I use is 7 mil thick), and leave out a gasket between the filter and cover.

All lenses will reflect off their outer surfaces, and so in a multi-lens system, light will always reflect off the front of a rear lens, some of which will reflect back from the rear of a front lens and make it back as a second image.  This is the "lens flare" effect you get with a camera pointed near the sun.  The larger the separation between the elements, the more the secondary image will be displaced (which is why doublet lenses are glued together to have zero separation).
If you look very closely in a mirror, you will also see a second image, which is reflected off the front of the glass (the primary image is reflected off the rear silvered surface).  The reason that isn't annoying, is that the primary image is so much brighter than the secondary, that you don't notice the other reflection.

Your gold lens works by reflecting, so there is much more light reflected off its front surface than would be reflected from a green filter.
Say that the rear surface of the cover lens reflects back 5% of the light, and the gold filter sends forward very nearly 100% of the light, but the green filter only reflects forward 10% of the light, then the ghost image with the gold filter will be quite visible, but the ghost image with the green filter will be too dim to see.

I've seen ghost images with my Speedglas, but they're a little different.  The Speedglas is highly reflective on the front, but the cover is curved, so the ghost is distorted (smaller than the actual image), and moves quickly across your view.  It is also only visible from just a couple of angles.
With a flat filter and cover, it will be the same size as what you're seeing, and will follow the image across all angles.
Parent - - By HOTRODWELDER5 (*) Date 01-01-2011 03:50
The cheap plastic ones have a raised flange around the border causing the clear lens to have a space between them, causing the reflection.
Parent - - By welder5354 (**) Date 01-05-2011 02:40
I have problems with air liquid lenses.  I find them too dull and hazy.
But i do find prostar the best lens.  It gives ME a much clearer vision to see the puddle for welding.
Parent - By strother (***) Date 01-05-2011 02:46
Is prostar the Praxair brand?
Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Seeing double with gold lens

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