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Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Rebuild Costs on SA-200 vs. Newer Machines
- - By Caleb C. (**) Date 01-02-2011 21:26
I'm debating on what to do with my machine. I have a '63 Redface that welds great but is needing a overhaul. I'm curious what it would run roughly to have it gone through and rebuilt. I would love to keep it and have it restored but I'm thinking for the cost I could probably pick up a used but nice 300D. Any rough guess on what it would run to have my machine redone? I will be using the machine (whichever I end up with) for general small scale fab, fencing, hanging red iron etc. What is ya'll's opinion on this? Keep the Redface and have it rebuilt or Upgrade to a Diesel machine? I'm just trying to decide what would be most cost effective and work out best in the long run.
Parent - - By Cactusthewelder (*****) Date 01-02-2011 23:08
Upgrade to a Diesel ! Fuel consumption alone is worth the upgrade
Parent - By scrappywelds (***) Date 01-03-2011 00:42
I dont own an engine driven welder, but ran almost all of them from time to time. It would be like this for me truck fuel and welder fuel would be the same. Diesels get better hr/fuel consumtion in my useage in my experience.
Parent - By KSellon (****) Date 01-03-2011 22:07
3-5k for rebuild-refurb
Parent - By TRC (***) Date 01-06-2011 00:37 Edited 01-06-2011 01:13
Hey Caleb, my opinion is to think about a TrailBlazer or Lincoln equivalent. It has every thing you need to do the work you listed. It doesn't sound like you have the need for a 300D. I have a Vantage 400, two TrailBlazers. I use a 69 Redface every day because of it's high quality arc that the others can't match. But I weld gas pipe every day. You can get a brand new TB for about the same price that a 3/4's of the way wore out 300D is gonna run you. Don't fall for that BS about an air cooled machine not being as good as water cooled. Yah their not gonna last 10,000 hrs but I have seen many with 4,000. At approx $3600 it's a good deal. Don't buy a TB diesel they are so loud that it's not worth any fuel savings. Plus by the time the fuel savings cost catches up with a gas model the generator will be worn out. The 07 Vantage doesn't get any better fuel milage than the TB. Rebuild the 200 and keep it for the future- Ted
- By Caleb C. (**) Date 01-03-2011 00:34
That's what I'm thinking Cactus, that's a huge reason to upgrade in my book. I have never personally ran a 300d, will they burn pretty similar to the 200's I'm used to using?
- - By JLWelding (***) Date 01-03-2011 00:59
Yea but you cant beat a 63 rebuilt Red Face with all new nuts bolts and custom paint. Not to mention the last machine you will ever have to buy. mho
Parent - By Cactusthewelder (*****) Date 01-03-2011 02:40
Unless you get a Vantage !
- - By Caleb C. (**) Date 01-03-2011 03:44
I agree a fully restored Redface would be pretty sweet. But I would want to go through it completely so it's not just a old machine with some slick paint. Some I've seen look pretty nice but on closer inspection they don't look too reliable. So I'd sure like to have it done right. Any ideas on what it costs to have one restored to a like-new, reliable state? Although I would rather have a diesel powerplant I believe, I do have a machine that is ready for rebuild and sitting in my shop. Secondly, if I do get rid of the '63, what could I expect to get out of it??
Parent - By KSellon (****) Date 01-03-2011 22:14
engine overhaul $2k
gen housing dip and bake $400
OEM idler upgrade $450
safety temp and oil gauge $120
dissy, assy, complete rewire and set up (turn key) $600
paint $450

mag rebuild, new or rebuilt carb, new hoses, new radiator,etc ????
Parent - By JLWelding (***) Date 01-04-2011 00:22
Sounds to me its worn out, I give ya 550.00
- - By Caleb C. (**) Date 01-04-2011 04:35
I think a running, welding Redface SA200 is worth more than that. Am I off track??
Parent - By raftergwelding (*****) Date 01-04-2011 13:30
if it runs and welds good and in decent shape sight unseen 1500 but you already said it needs an overhaul so 1500 would be max but i'd have to see it and run it first but i am not in the market for a machine right now just answering your question
Parent - By FixaLinc (****) Date 01-04-2011 21:15
Take it to Cruce's consignment auction at Abernathy probably bring $800 to $1200.
Parent - By Cumminsguy71 (*****) Date 01-05-2011 15:13
The old 51' short hood I had/have(sold some pieces), I figured around $3k for overhauling it by calling and asking around, checking prices and so on. That was building the engine and doing most of the work myself. But had added costs in that, sandblasting and powder coating frame, hood, housings. If you got time and don't need the machine in a rush and can plunk away at it in the down time. I was in a similar situation, had the short hood and the ranger, not much time or when I had time not much money. I found a machine for $3k and it had been checked out, cleaned up etc, ended up buying it instead so I could deep six the ranger. The machine I got has ac power which is something I needed but still has the bullet proof F163. After about 50-60 years of them building that I figured they have had plenty of time to work any and all bugs out, kinda like a Chevy 350, about the time they got it perfected they changed.

As far as diesels go, yes they do get better "mileage" sort of speak. Look at it this way, a gasoline engine maintains or tries to maintain a 14.7 to 1 air fuel mixture in ideal conditions. A diesel, as explained to me by a long time GM teacher will run at 25 to 1 air fuel ratio and that is pullin her guts out, so idling along it's even better. If you ran a gas engine at that ratio you'd have 4 pistons with custom ventilation holes in the top of them. So as the air/fuel ratio on a gasser such as the continental's they didn't have computer controls to maintain that ratio, so under a load or your dad's old pickup truck pulling a gooseneck full of hay will suck gas and fuel mileage will go from 14mpg to 8-9mpg. A diesel will still consume less fuel than a gasser under the same conditions. I'm fully loaded on my truck and still can bang out 16mpg. A gasser would be in the negative mpg range!

http://autospeed.com/cms/title_Common-Rail-Diesel-Engine-Management-Part-1/A_108104/article.html

sorry, the above article shows 17:1 to 29:1 ratio at full load with idle or no load which can exceed 145:1. They don't call diesels fuel sippers for nothing. The only down side to a diesel is maintenance costs. On a gas engine, plugs, wires, pretty much everything is relatively cheap compared to a diesel. Injectors, injection pump when they go out hopefully you have enough work to cover the costs of the repairs. Diesel injectors don't like water in the fuel, if water makes it to the injectors it tends to blow the tip of the injector off....seen it. So good filtration is a must. Luckily, for the most part diesel injectors/injection pumps are built very well and will last a long time with nothing done to them. Newer computer controlled injectors or unit injectors, ehhh, replaced many myself and have talked to many with newer Dodge/Fords/Chevy's that have had injectors replaced way before their time. An older Sa with the Perkapillar diesel or deutz diesel, excellent engines, nearly indestructable....nearly.

ok, gotta go....

Shawn
- - By roundydownie (**) Date 01-05-2011 04:09 Edited 01-05-2011 04:13
get your 200 rebuilt   i have had mine for 3yrs and put two batteries in it  I dont care what anyone says  your gonna put any new one in the shop in three yrs  but all i do is weld pipe and dont need the ac power  they are gonna weld ten times better then any other machine on pipe  mine will run three days on a tank and thats good to me   i dont need the stupid digital read outs and all the fancy knobs to get the job done  just a start button and on/off switch
Parent - - By KSellon (****) Date 01-07-2011 15:51
I wish there was a "like" button
Parent - - By roundydownie (**) Date 01-08-2011 01:56
whats up kaye? This is Josh from Duncan
Parent - By KSellon (****) Date 01-08-2011 18:26
Hey Josh B-- how are ya. I love the comment you made. xx
Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Rebuild Costs on SA-200 vs. Newer Machines

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