CWI in China

Date 02-24-2011 10:41

If you cannot speak Mandarin, you have to request for interpreter to be with you full time (24hrs if needed).
They want you? I guess you must be a highly skilled CWI...a Mandarin speaking Inspectors from Malaysia & Singapore will cost you around US$10K to US$12K per month (exclusive of Hotel, food, transport expenses)

S.Korea is more famous for dog meat, Vietnam too, but in China....the way you ask seems that you have no option for food. I don't think you are a traveller. Be prepared, you may get homesick. Ask your Mom to courier food for you...no joke.

By weldorguy (*)

Date 02-28-2011 05:09

Joey,

Ugh... no kosher meals is one thing but I draw the line at dog and weird stuff... no pork either... lol to the Mom thing. I haven't asked them about a translator but wouldn't marrying someone there be cheaper??? <--- I've got questions about the customs and the programs they have in place for expats like me. I'm skilled enough I guess but really am I any different then anyone? Learning is a natural thing, I've got thousands invested in Engineering books, that and I caught a little mistake that wasn't in the drawings; it got by the engineers, riggers, crane guys and BMW's Engineers and Designers....so I kinda got lucky that I caught a small but very important detail that everybody over looked.

Joey with that information you gave me do you know what they usually pay for inspectors???

By Joey

Date 02-28-2011 10:24

The Mom thing is true, It happened to me before when I’m working in Kuwait (like a desert storm). When you are eating the same food everyday, I’m sure you will get fed up. To stay longer, I’ve asked my Mom to courier for me my native food like dried pork, dried fish, canned foods which were not available at site or in town.

Your first night in China will surely good food especially if you are representing the customer. Compliments with leg massage after dinner and karaoke. Not to worry, it’s a welcome gesture. You have no obligation and don’t hesitate to reject their product if quality not good. They will not harass you, since they know that you cannot speak their language (that is the advantage).

If it’s in the contract, I will advise you to choose a very beautiful translator. This will help you to stay longer and give you daily inspiration at WORK.

If you just a normal CWI, the problem will be the cost…because you have to compete with the Chinese CWI from Singapore or Malaysia who are at least bilingual (Mandarin & English). I’m sure you will ask for more pay than what you are getting at home. A wise employer will get someone much cheaper than your demand and much effective for the job….These employers will normally get from manpower supply companies or agency who managed everything (travel insurance, air ticket, taxes, accommodation etc).

I’m involved in TPI company that supply Inspectors in Asia and I know the market rate for Chinese Inspector from Singapore or Malaysia.

Good luck
Joey

By thirdeye (***)

Date 02-24-2011 19:14

A CWI I work with recently did two 6 week assignments there. He had both a driver and a liaison, which he could not have functioned without. He did live in a hotel that had a more western atmosphere, like our style of toilets and a restraunt that served some food which was closer to home so to speak. Some of the better local food he ate was from street vendors... things like breads, dumplings, grilled meats and fish, and soup. He did take along a huge amount of peanut butter, hard candies, canned goods and toilet paper. When it was all said and done, he lost 15 pounds.

~thirdeye~

By 803056

Date 02-25-2011 14:30

I guess a couple of weeks in China might prove to be a good thing for a fellow with my physique! ;)

Al

By eekpod

Date 02-25-2011 19:46

I have no idea, but start high, you can always come down,. it's hard to go up.

By jarcher (**)

Date 02-26-2011 17:58

I once went to Taipei on R&R and ate at the street vendors. Had the thundering ****s for weeks after.

By 803056

Date 02-27-2011 04:42

So, that's where the weight goes! ;)

Al

By weldorguy (*)

Date 02-28-2011 05:12

I'd frickn DIE!!! I loose weight way too fast!!!

I like being 260lbs and am comfortable there... I did some time away with no one looking after me and making sure i ate and came back 213lbs... My friends and family thought I was dying...

By 3.2 Inspector (***)

Date 03-04-2011 04:37

As Nantong say, start out with 100 usd an hour, or make a daily rate of 1000 usd.
Depending on which city you will work in, you are in for a blast.

There are PLENTY of choices for western food, besides, some of the Chinese food is pretty good as well.
The girls.....AMAZING!

I have been in Shanghai for almost a year now, I am not going back to Europe again any time soon.

3.2

By Ringo

Date 03-04-2011 11:57

I was an welding inspector in Hong Kong for a while,but never made that kind of money.You are right about the food and the women.

By Joey

Date 03-04-2011 16:37 Edited 03-04-2011 16:46

3.2

1000 USD / day for a CWI in China? maybe the post is more than just a CWI. That could be a CWI cum scientist :) imagine 30K per month, more than enough to pay the large number of the chinese factory workers.

We ever quoted for a QA/QC manager to work in onshore / offshore job in Brunei. We proposed a caucasian staff asking for US$1000/day and we lost the job to a competitor who used a Filipino staff with lower rate than us. You will surely get a higher pay in Brunei than in China.

USD1K/day for a CWI is trully amazing one :)

Joey

PS. I normally go to China (Shenzhen, Shanghai, Beijing) for factory audit.

By 3.2 Inspector (***)

Date 03-04-2011 17:37

its very normal.
I sometimes charge 9.000 RMB per 10 hour day, not including hotel and allowance, which is another 1500 RMB.

Not to mention the rental of equipment.

3.2

By Shane Feder (****)

Date 03-05-2011 11:29

Joey,
Nantong has lived and worked a long time in China - if he states US$100 an hour for an expat inspector that is the going rate.
3.2 supported that comment.
I spent 2 years in New Caledonia with 3000 pinoy and some of them were brilliant inspectors - equal to anywhere in the world.
However, if the client wants European inspectors rather than Asian inspectors then he pays the going rate for European inspectors.
Cheers,
Shane

By weldorguy (*)

Date 03-05-2011 13:07

O what's the European salary like then....an inspector here in Canada (fantastic welder and mentor) told me the guys in the uk all drive bentlys and rolls royces and have been on that "million dollar quest" ever since. I'm getting my passport ready now ($75)

So do cwi in the uk make $100+ per hour after expenses and that's why the big bill for china? I wouldn't dare do it cheaper then that after all it's sorta still not enough....a house my size would be $10,000,000 US there :s although the "villa's" look inviting.

Btw did anyone know Disney was hiring structural plate welders.

By Joey

Date 03-05-2011 16:47

Hi Shane

You have the point there, but I also understand that the contract was usually given to China because of cheaper cost than doing it in other countries…the aim is to save cost in General. What I understand, those European inspectors (senior level / auditors) that go to this place are part timer only, they will normally hired a full time inspector from local TPI agency to represent them. The performance of this local inspector can be monitored by reviewing their daily or weekly inspection reports.

I tell you my experiences, I have represented many Japanese clients when I was stationed in Indonesia and they will only come to visit you whenever there are serious problems happened at worksite. For Europeans, they will visit you based on planned audit schedules. Americans, they will come in batch sent by their mother company from US to train the local workers. Only the senior management level will stay longer, the rest (small fry) will go back after helping to set up the factory. I remembered that I was interviewed and approved by DOT personnel as TPI during manufacturing of non-resuable/non-refilable welded steel cylinders in Singapore. The factory did not hire an American TPI even though these cylinders will be exported to USA….because I think the main reason is high cost of engaging a full time American TPI.

Regards
Joey

By 3.2 Inspector (***)

Date 03-06-2011 03:38

The factory did not hire an American TPI even though these cylinders will be exported to USA….because I think the main reason is high cost of engaging a full time American TPI.

How high is the reject rate, once it arrive to the client in the US?
I have seen it a few times now, a EU/US client buy a product in China, send out a few wankers to do a factory audit before production start. MANY times they decide to save the money for a western TPI and decide for a cheap Chinese inspector.

I highly welcome this strategy, after the first shipment companies like mine will be hired to sort out the ****, and thats when the rate usually becomes a bit higher.
We end up making the same amount of man hours, but at a higher rate.

The Chinese CAN make high quality products, but they will cheat you if they think they can get away with it.

3.2

By Joey

Date 03-06-2011 13:45

CSWIP 3.2

You are asking for the cylinders that I released to US more than 10years ago…well, I believe zero percent rejection, because I did not hear complain till today :)

By the way, my race is not Chinese. The TPI company that assigned me to the job provides indemnity insurance for inspection & testing works undertake by their employees. I believe the US client was clever in selection of TPI company. Furthermore at that time, the DOT inspection requirements for making cylinders abroad are more stringent than those US domestically made cylinders.

If you will select a WANKERS COMPANY, you need to blame first the Top Management of EU/US client who is responsible for selection and hiring of TPI company and their Inspectors. The client should ask for CVs and call for interview of Inspectors before the work start. The client should also assign someone competent like you who regularly monitor / review the reports submitted by TPI. If the client has a lousy management system, you cannot put the blame to the Chinese Inspectors alone.

As I said earlier, without an interpreter, it will be very difficult for non-mandarin speaking Inspector to work in China. You mean to say “the Chinese will not cheat when there is a western TPI around? but how do you know that they are not cheating you when you yourself don’t understand their language?

There are plenty of good Chinese Inspectors from Singapore and Malaysia (holding both CSWIP 3.1/3.2 & AWS CWI certification). Don’t tell me their performance can be predicted as substandard. What about sending those “western Chinese TPI” in China? do you think they’re acceptable? I hope that your message has nothing to do with the TPI's color of skin.

~Joey~
Pinoy Inspector

By 3.2 Inspector (***)

Date 03-07-2011 05:00

aaahhhh, the 'Color of skin card'

That card was removed from the deck ages ago, its 2011 now!

3.2

By nantong (**)

Date 03-10-2011 02:58

Pinoy are some of the well-most crafted people I have ever come across (apart from us Scots!).However for leadership it takes people from the West to give them direction (OK Shane you are a Kiwi but I include you and your Aussie cousins in this term). In China company's come here for economic reasons that is to produce goods at the cheapest price. However if the goods are no good what use are they? How to resolve this problem? Put in a foreign engineer or inspector to supervise construction. One man, high cost but in the big picture it is small. Shane you are an important man in Thailand. Prove ur importance to them.

By Joey

Date 03-05-2011 16:28

Hi 3.2

Roughly I understand the other task of the CWI when you mentioned about the rental of equipment.

Good money, a tip of 100RMB is surely “peanuts” in karaoke bar.

Enjoy :)

Joey

By nantong (**)

Date 03-10-2011 03:10

Joey, i think you were on the bay bridge project (for a short while anyway) Where is the KTV on Chang Xing Island? Bay Bridge Project was pretty f***d up. This must be the wort consruction company in the world.ZPMC. you still do business with them

By Joey

Date 03-10-2011 10:11

nantong, I visited these companies - Zhejiang Jinggong Steel Building Co Ltd, Shanghai Grand Tower Steel Structure Co Ltd, Shanghai Cosco Kawasaki Heavy Industries Steel Structure Co Ltd, Zilei Heavy Steel Structure Const (Shanghai) Co Ltd’s fabrication shops. I went there to audit the factories. I was hired by Clients from Singapore...on and off.

By nantong (**)

Date 03-14-2011 22:56

Sorry Joey I thought you had experience of living and working in China. My apoligies. four audits on Chinese companys does not constitute a lot of experience. I have been here in China at the sharp end for over eight years. and and have worked in Singapore/Malaysia for nine years so I know the standard of inspectors from each country. Singapore/Malaysian inspectors tend to get jobs here not on their technical ability but on their ability of being able to speak Chinese and English. Who am I to judge? I am a registered engineer with the Engineering Councll United Kingdom and have had a Senior Welders certificate from The Welding Institute Cambridge England (CSWIP) for 25 years.

By Joey

Date 03-15-2011 08:41

nantong

No worries at all. I tell you when I was in ExxonMobil, my boss was a Scottish and I have difficulty understanding his English because of strong accent. For 8yrs, have you learn to speak mandarin? How do you communicate with China-man then in English?

Sorry to disagree with you. I don’t think that I need to dig more China Babes before you believe me :lol:

. Singapore/Malaysian inspector who speak Chinese and English is very good enough, their technical abilities as Inspector are supported by their CSWIP / AWS certifications and experienced in other similar projects. Don’t get confuse, the subject is CWI. I’m not referring to trickshaw drivers or coffee shop attendants that you will pick up from the road side of Malaysia / Singapore and send it over to China as inspector.

Unless there is no choice because of some exotic performance :lol:

to be done by CWI, I will not hire a westerner or non Mandarin speaking inspector for just a normal CWI job in China. Mainly because of language barrier, their high salary and the need to get an interpreter.

I’m fortunate to have a companion (co auditor) who write and speak Chinese very well whenever I have to work in China. Otherwise, I’m a useless a$$, it’s not easy to get a very good interpreter in China factories.

In the past, I used to pretend that I’m a CAWI because I know that someday I may need to post some silly or novice questions in the forum. I’m young and can’t beat your 25yrs of experienced....but if your ticket is just a CSWIP 3.2, I will bet my Inspection Certifications (SCWI & APIs) are equal / and more than yours.

:lol:

~Joey~

By nantong (**)

Date 03-18-2011 21:38

Joey I am a qualified welding engineer as well as a CSWIP senior inspector, have been in the far east for 30 years working for major construction companys in the petrochemical, mining and oil and gas industries and have been married to a Chinese woman for 27 years. No disrepect but I think I know what I am talking about. Regards.

By Joey

Date 03-20-2011 16:56

nantong, It's interesting to know about yourself. You are definitely a high calibre staff, those worth paying US$100/hr.

Nevertheless, I’m referring to those common work scope of the CWI which I believe a Singaporean / Malaysian Chinese Inspector is able to perform. I will recommend that they are much suitable and cheaper than those western non-speaking Chinese Inspector. Fyi, my current job allows me to hire and supply Inspectors, and to provide budgetary rates for TPI, QC or Owner inspectors. I’m involved in the monitoring of Inspector’s work performances so as to ensure client requirements are met. As long as the client requirements are related to CWI works, 101%, these Singaporean / Malaysian Chinese Inspectors are able to do the job.

My present company (accredited) has Inspectors supplied to UL(Underwriters Laboratories). In the 90s I have worked for Haggie Patterson, Consulting Inspection & Testing Engineers, United Kingdom, Wimpey, Man GHH Logistics GMBH, Germany, Thielsch Engineering Inc, Rhode Island, USA etc. I wonder why these companies did not send their western Inspectors in Asia.

Regards
Joey

Ps. I have a Chinese wife too…but she came from a City where the import and sale of chewing gum is ban.

By nantong (**)

Date 03-21-2011 12:49

Joey, China adds 400,000 degreed qualified engineers to their pool of talent every year and I would say every Chinese inspector has an engineering degree. Most Malaysian or Singapore Chinese inspectors are not qualified to the same level but do speake English well. Tell me what the US adds or my country adds every year to the development of engineers? We are falling further and further behind. Our countrys are making it so hard every year for kids to get a decent education because of costs. The best kids cannot be developed unless they have the money.This is a fact. In China the best kids are given free education based on their potential. We are falling so far behind. Make no mistake I am not a Communist idealist. I do not want my country to be left behind because of politicians corrupted by the government controlled by big banking systems which have failed and have to be bailed out by our governments.
Has anyone out there seen the film Outside Job? Does anyone dispute what this movie says? They are all still there lining there pockets at the average workers expense draining the money from the money the average worker has paid into a lifetime of pension funds. No government control of investment bankers will bring the western economy system down. China still maintains the old sytem that my generation were used to. No collatteral, no guarantee no loan. Why do the banking system are allowed to allow to make loans on something that they know cannot be repaid. They have made a huge industry of genetrating losses and have grown so big the goevernments cannot allow them to go bust AND THEY KNOW THIS. I remember when I was a kid I wanted a loan for an new engine for my Mini Cooper S and everyone said f*ck off until you give us a guarantee of repayment. My sisters son bought a car when he was quite young without his mother knowing and was unable to meet the repayments so my sister had to make up the bad debt, the company that made the loan did not give a sh*t they got their money back. Maybe I will be cut off on this one. So much for the free world. Adieu.

By Joey

Date 03-10-2011 11:05

Ps. nantong, thanks for the compliments.....when you said ""Bay Bridge Project was pretty f***d up. This must be the wort consruction company in the world.""..does it mean you failed to guide them in a proper direction :lol:

I must admit that I'm not an expert on providing right direction to the China-Chinese workers...but If I will be consulted on the selection of foreign engineer to lead them....I will recommend to get a Chinese from Singapore / Hongkong / Taiwan or Malaysia.

By welderbrent (*****)

Date 03-10-2011 14:55

Slight hijack,

This has been very interesting to me. WHY? Just hearing where and what some of you guys have done gives me a new appreciation for both the reach of the credentials of the CWI program and the impact of the codes developed here in the USA on projects around the world. Not that all applications are the same and I realize you also have other standards you work to as well. But I see many things here that have broadened my ideas of our work.

But it also seems workers are the same around the world... They will get away with whatever the customer will let them get away with. Management wants more profit while bidding low to get the work. Workers want to impress management with production (sometimes; others don't care). Most any of us will get a little sloppy when our feet aren't held to the fire by consistent inspections to a defined standard for quality.

Thanks for all the open discussion.

Have a Great Day, Brent