Hi All,
I'm not sure were to post this question, so I hope that it will be read anyway, and hopefully I'll get some directions.
During our latest external ISO audit, the auditors found us in non compliance for the following: our MGAW processes are considered "Special processes", and as such, we have to provide some additional information about our processes, training, qualification, certification, etc.
The main request that puzzles me is "Ensure all Manual Welding equipment approval requirements are properly defined", as written in the audit corrective action plan, so my question is: Are there any specific equipment approval requirements mentioned somewhere in any AWS standard or somewhere else? As I'm reading through Chapter 4 - GMAW of the Welding Handbook - Welding processes, the book mentions equipment requirements / components, but no "equipment approval requirements".
Any comments, help is appreciated.
George
AWS D1.5 requires the meters on the weldng machine to be calibrated, but there is no approval process for the machine that I know of.
Al
Hi Al,
Thank you for the suggestion. I'll check the AWS D1.5.
Best regards,
George
Can you go back to the auditor for clarification?
Do you have approved/qualified WPS's? Are your Welders Trained & Qualified? Do you maintain continuity reports for them? Are your Inspectors Trained & Qualified? Is all that documented?
Do you have a calibration procedure for your equipment?
If not, Keep It Simple!
Use a calibrated Fluke meter on the output studs of CV equipment and insure volt meters are within a reasonable tolerance (reasonable is what your write into that cal. procedure).
Use a calibrated tape measure (cheap) and calibrated stop watch (cheap) to check WFS on digital equipment (6 seconds of wire feed, measure the result, multiply by 10. Done!). (Side note: Don't put current on your CV GMAW/FCAW procedures. Use WFS. That's what Welders set isn't it?.)
Use a calibrated current meter to check current on CC equipment.
Buy one, calibrated, nozzle attached, flow meter and use it to set flow on all gas shielded equipment, and take the frickin' gages off those surge guards, or use an orifice type flow device and mount them on the inlet of the feeder.
There, I just wrote your Machine Calibration Procedure for you.
I can't believe I just give that $hit away.
PWC
Hi PWC,
Definitely, I'll have to go back to the auditor for clarifications.
Regarding WPS's, we have them recorded for everyday usage but not officially approved/qualified. Regarding training and qualification of welders, inspectors and engineers (me included): this is a kind of "work in progress" with lots of room for improvement.
Thank you very much for the comprehensive reply and suggestions.
Best regards,
George
Hmmm....I've heard the "list the WFS not the amperage" argument a few times and just speaking from a different perspective, I would disagree. Especially when used with GMAW short circuit transfer. Amperage is crucial, as well as all the set parameters for this. When performing destructive testing over the years I've noticed certain ampere ranges are more prone to incomplete fusion/cold lap. Obviously we know electrode extension (stick out) is very important and has an affect on amperage. When someone is welding out of position it is very easy to lose the optimum electrode extension and pull back, thus producing less amperage. If the welder is in the low range of an established WFS range he could be well outside of an effective amperage usage. Listing the amperage range controls the technique to a larger degree...I think at least for whatever that's worth. Also, I feel it's easier to control through the calibration process. Wire feed speeds in relation to amperage output vary, although they're not supposed to much. I have many of the exact same model feeders set up right now, off the exact same model power sources. None have the same amerage reading for a given wire feed speed. Some are off as much as 40 ipms to produce the same amerage. I do list 'suggested' WFS along with the amerage range. Again, I do feel that this controls the quality better and gives the welder an appreciation for proper technique.
Hi Jarsanb,
Our WPS's list both amperage and WFS, just to have a better understanding of the ranges allowed for both parameters
Thank you for your input.
Best regards,
George
jarsanb, I would agree that amperage is crucial. The original question has to do with an ISO audit. A typical question in an ISO audit may be, "How do you insure this machine operates within these parameters?" Again, I say, Keep It Simple. If my WPS is written correctly, in regards to CV equipment, the WFS range, the Electrode Diameter and the Electrode Extension listed on the WPS will give the the current level I require.
In a typical Constant Voltage (CV), semi-automatic GMAW application I don't believe it's practical to ask the Welder (thru a WPS) to set and maintain current. Once he/she drops their hood and pulls the trigger they have no clue what current that machine is putting out, but they are sure that the voltage and WFS will be constant.
George, I'm not sure how you can operate under ISO and AWS with the response you gave about Welder Qual, Insp. Qual and procedures. I have a name for it... Your Free-Stylin'. That may work in Snow Boarding, Swimming or Dirt Bikes, but it's got no place in a Weld Shop.
PWC
Paul, I guess it comes down to how someone's QC is applied. I could agree that from the welder's perspective WFS and electrode extension could be applied in the WPS and be effective. But we do alot of internal inspections and audits as well as third party inspections and state inpectors. WFS and the stick out are used to control the amperage. If there is an inspector out on a job site and they are checking the WPS and welding operations they could verify that the WFS is within range but how would they verify the electrode extension is in conformance during the welding cycle? In my experience, it has been useful to include both the WFS and the Amperage and with this information you can accurately predict the electrode extension or proper technique for inspection/audit purposes. Anyway, just a different point of view with all due respect.
By George 
Date 05-09-2012 14:50
Edited 05-09-2012 14:57
Hi Paul,
Sorry for giving you an incomplete response regarding our documentation. It definitely sounds as you named it ... "Free-Stylin'". I still have to work on it (I mean the documentation) to bring it fully to standard requirements, but the initial question was related to the auditor's request to "Ensure all Manual Welding equipment approval requirements are properly defined". It sounds like we have to proove how we selected the equipment to ensure that it will do the job, and who and what approval criteria was used? Other than making sure that the welding machines are suitable for MGAW and their power range, as well as wire feeding speeds, cover all thickness ranges, I'm not sure what else should be done. By the way, all our welding machines are Miller Deltaweld 451, 452, 652, and Dimensions 452, some new some older but definitely suitable...
By the way (again
), your website is very impressive and it made for a very pleasant and interesting reading.
George
The statement "Ensure all Manual Welding equipment approval requirements are properly defined" sounds to me like he wants you to define in your quality program who selects welding equipment for procurement or for assigned jobs. Perhaps he is suggesting someone needs to be responsible for ensuring the appropriate machine is selected for the welding procedure to be used?
Hi MB,
I totally agree with you, and I'm about to add to our welding processes manual a paragraph about the equipment selection and requirements, as per Welding Handbook - Welding Processes, but I was curious if there is any standard mentioning any specific requirements about equipment approval. I do have to go back to the auditor for additional clarifications.
Thank you very much for your input.
George
You'll find this in a lot of industry-specific publications. The beauty of it is, for ISO9001, all you need to show for compliance is that you have requirements for the selection of equipment. You can satisfy this requirement by saying something as simple as "Welding machines shall be of the manually controlled type, and shall contain suitable means of controlling output variables." Or whatever statement would suit your equipment. Good luck.
Hi Curt,
This is exactly the kind of answer I was hoping for. You just made my day.
Thank you very much!
George
