What is the correct symbol for a joint that has two diff gro

Date 10-09-2012 19:09

What is the correct symbol for a joint that has two different groove types? If the one side is a single bevel and the other side is a j-groove and they both are on the same side of the joint (or plate side, one joint total) what would you call it or how what symbol would you use on your print?

Attachment: joint.png - Combo Joint (4k)

By TimGary (****)

Date 10-09-2012 19:26

I'd call it a screw up...

However, the tail of the welding symbol is for notes or other items that cannot be described by standard symbols.
You can either write out a note or draw a picture of the joint design in the tail.

Tim

By jwright650 (*****)

Date 10-09-2012 19:40

I have no idea how to address that situation. This is a new one on me, and I thought that I had seen a variety of odd situations. My first inclination was to go browse through AWS A2.4, but I did not see anything that addresses this type of preparation at all.(different groove configs on the same side of the joint)
EDIT
I agree with Tim...put instructions in the tail of the symbol to show the welder/fitter what needs to be done.

By 99205

Date 10-10-2012 00:57

That situation needs to be addressed in the tail. The tail should refer to a note that contains all applicable dimensions and special instructions.

By Tyrone

Date 10-10-2012 10:54

I assume the two mating parts already have the bevel and J-groove prior to fit-up? If so, it doesn't really matter calling out the exact symbol since the Welder wouldn't prep to the joint detail. I would either call out a Vee groove, or U groove showing the cross section of that joint. Specifying the throat size on the weld symbol is more important.
Tyrone

By 803056

Date 10-09-2012 20:35

Standard welding symbols are adequate for 90 to 95% of the situations encountered; however, there are always a few situations where a standard symbol simply doesn't fit the bill. In those cases a detail showing the cross section through the joint is appropriate.

A reference line with arrow pointing to the joint is considered to be a welding symbol. It is the same as simply stating , "Weld here", without specifying the type of weld, i.e. fillet, groove, plug, etc. The addition of a tail and a reference to a detail showing the joint cross section provides the welder with the information needed to properly prepare and weld the joint.

Best regards - Al

NonstandardJointDetail9-Oct-2012Model1.jpg (84k)

By eekpod

Date 10-10-2012 10:21

So let me ask the next question.
Would it be a pre-qualified joint per D1.1?
Even though both joints on their own are pre-qualified, I have never seen each one used on either side of the same joint, so my inclination would be to say no it is not.
Open to discussion.
Be sure to look at the pieces in the sketch the OP has to be sure you understand the bevels of the parts.

By TimGary (****)

Date 10-10-2012 11:22

Nope.
Not only because it's an atypical joint, but also because it has no backing, and so on..

Tim

By 803056

Date 10-10-2012 16:34

I agree with Tim regarding whether the detail is prequalified.

My sketch was intended to show how a detail can be referenced in the tail of the welding symbol. I use the same approach for skewed joints since the welded skew is neither a fillet nor a groove weld, plus there is no mechanism to address the presence of the Z-loss. The sketch eliminates most of the questions.

Best regards - Al