Notes call for E-70 series electrodes

Date 10-31-2012 06:37

That note:"E-70 series electrodes" Only really lets you know the tensile strength of the filler/electrode.
It can be used to refer to: SMAW, FCAW, GMAW, SAW...
PWC

By fschweighardt (***)

Date 10-31-2012 10:53

E-70xx should only be referencing SMAW or possibly FCAW, althought FCAW with E70 would be referencing a flat and horiz. fillet only wire
GMAW and GTAW wolud be ER-70x-x
SAW could be F7xxx

By welderbrent (*****)

Date 10-31-2012 13:48 Edited 10-31-2012 17:36

While you are technically correct, all of my contact with GSN's from engineers that state as the OP stated are referencing any of the D1.1 approved processes with a 70 series electrode. They will approve your submitted WPS's in FCAW-G or FCAW-S, GMAW (Spray only), SMAW, and/or SAW (which is not in use 99% of the time, especially in the field) as long as you are using a 70 series electrode that is low hydrogen in nature. We know what that means for SMAW (99% of the time it will be 7018) and a good share of the commonly used wire electrodes and gas combinations for GMAW and FCAW qualify as well.

BUT, either way, you must submit the WPS's, Welder's Certs, and material specs (probably with the MTR's) before work begins to get engineer approval. It covers both you and the engineer plus it is in the codes and usually in the GSN's as well. Along with your shop drawings.

Then, don't forget to get ahold of the inspection agency for the job and see if any pre-work inspections will be required either by customer, job specs, or code.

Now, it sounds like the OP is the inspector on the job. You need to find the submittals (WPS's and welders' certs) to see what the engineer approved. BUT, more than likely, wire is okay under the specs as you have stated them. You will need to make sure of the wire, gas, operating parameters, etc. Some FCAW-S wires are not multi-pass pre-qualified by manufacturer's specifications/recomendations. Any gas process on field erection you will need to watch wind speed (see 5.12.1 in D1.1-2008).

If they are already setting up for work this needs to be accomplished pretty quickly. Should have been taken care of at a pre-work meeting. LOL!! :lol:

About 10% of the time if we are lucky.

Have a Great Day, Brent

By fschweighardt (***)

Date 10-31-2012 14:04 Edited 10-31-2012 14:07

I know it is nit-picky, but that is how the A5.xx docs read.

Pretty sure that any 70ksi filler would be approved, OP didn't say anything about hydrogen requirements, but most common 70 series stick is 7018, which is usually low enough in H2. Most of the other possible 70ksi fillers would be low H2 as well, but we dont know the H2 requirement, if any: H4, H8, H16???

Long story short, need to contact owner, EOR or whatever and find out exactly what was intended and make sure that is what is/was delivered.

By 803056

Date 11-01-2012 03:29

I hate to say it, but most structural engineers know relatively little about welding. Few differentiate between SMAW, FCAW, or GMAW (never mind short circuiting transfer). All they know is that if a 70ksi filler metal is used the tensile strength is 70,000psi.

Few structural engineers differentiate between hydrogen controlled electrodes and non-hydrogen controlled electrodes. With this being said, AWS D1.1 places the responsibility for reviewing and approving welding procedures squarely at the feet of the Engineer.

The inspector must walk a tight line in letting the Engineer know that the particular WPS does or does not meet the requirements for hydrogen control and whether the base metal being welded requires hydrogen controls. It isn't smart to make a big issue of any shortcomings that makes the Engineer look silly, but still, he must be made aware of the concerns. My tact is to ask stupid questions that points the Engineer in the right direction. Most take the hints, some don't. Stronger actions are then needed when code requirements are not being met. A request for a written response usually gets the desired attention. It is what I refer to as the "Colombo" tactic.

As Brent says, the general note "E70" typically refers to the minimum tensile strength, not the specific welding process.

Best regards - Al