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Up Topic Welding Industry / ASME Codes / PMI on Carbon Steel Welding Consumables during receiving.
- - By Nalla (***) Date 03-03-2013 10:32
Dear Experts
I never had witnessed PMI.

PMI on Non-Carbon Steel Welding consumable

What are the non-carbon steel electordes ?- CuNi, SS , DSS , SDSS - GTAW/SMAW Electrodes / Wire Rods?
Why and how it shoud be documented?
What is the acceptance criteria?
Thanks
Attachment: PMI.pdf (18k)
Parent - By 803056 (*****) Date 03-03-2013 14:19
Hello Nalla;

Are you working to an ASME construction code or AWS?

Sticking my neck out and assuming you are, the carbon steel filler metals for SMAW, GMAW, GTAW, and FCAW are contained in the following standards:
AWS A5.1 / ASME SFA5.1
AWS A5.18 / ASME SFA5.18
AWS A5.20 / ASME SFA5.20
AWS A5.28 / ASME SFA5.28
AWS A5.29 / ASME SFA5.29

The warning that the PMI should be preformed on a weld deposit is worth considering. Alloys can be added to the flux to provide the proper alloy balance in the weld deposit. Consider E316-26 SMAW electrode, the weld deposit is similar to the AISI alloy 316, but the core wire of the electrode is similar to that of an E6010. All the chrome and nickel required to provide the proper balance is contained in the flux covering.

The PMI "guns" used by some inspectors uses the principle of X-ray diffraction. These guns can not detect and measure the lighter elements such as carbon.

I usually weld a sample as described in the appropriate filler metal specification and send it to a lab for testing. The test method should be as defined by the filler metal specification.

Best regards - Al
Parent - - By Superflux (****) Date 03-03-2013 14:22
What I have done in the past is what we called a "Button Weld Metal Test".
This is where we would have the welders burn half to a complete rod (or Electrode) in a one inch diameter puddle. Then let it cool for a minute or five. Clean slag (if applicable) and lay down another rod on top of that. This was to ensure that we had as pure of weld metal deposit as reasonably possible that was not diluted /adulterated by base metal. Then PMI that "button" of weld metal.
If memory serves me, there was a Spread sheet made up that recorded all these tests and was entered in the "Job Book".
Acceptance criteria was that the resultant chemistry met the manufacturer's claim.
Parent - - By Nalla (***) Date 03-03-2013 22:34
Dear Al
Requirement is PMI on Non-consumable electrodes/wire rods- What dose it mean and classification No,pls
Working Codes- ASME Sect IX and ASME B31.3
Base materials used in this project - CS, SS, CuNI, Inconel and Monel
Weld Processes - GTAW +SMAW
What is the whole purpose- to confirm readings shown in Manufacturer's Cert are correct and/or if it conform to respective ASTM spec.?

Does manufacturer themselves do carry out PMI before relasing the cert.- Is it normal practise?

Thanks
Parent - - By 803056 (*****) Date 03-04-2013 01:35
I believe there is a communication problem.

A non-consumable electrode would be one that would not be consumed when making a weld. An example of a nonconsumable electrode is a tungsten electrode when welding with GTAW or PAW.

Consumable electrodes would be filler metals that are melted by the arc and become weld metal.

AWS writes the filler metal specifications as A5.X documents. ASME reviews the AWS filler metal specifications and adopts them for ASME construction as SFA5.X documents. Thus AWS A5.1 becomes ASME SFA5.1. AWS A5.18 becomes ASME SFA5.18, and so on.

The purpose of PMI is to verify you received the filler metal you ordered and no one in the supply chain made a mistake.

A review of the filler metal specification will tell you whether the chemistry listed is the chemistry of the raw filler metal or the deposited weld metal. When checking FM for GTAW the chemistry may be of the bare FM. In the case of SMAW where the flux is the vehicle used to add alloy content to the weld deposit, such as in the case of an E8018-B2L, you have to make a weld sample as described in the applicable FM specification (SFA5.5 in this case).

The manufacturer has to have a quality control system that ensures the FM meets the applicable specification. However, there is no ASME or AWS audits involved. The manufacturer certifies the FM meets the applicable requirements of the FM specification. You either trust your supplier or you perform PMI.

That being said, the purchaser can specify a higher level of QC by invoking a "higher" level of testing and supporting documentation. AWS A5.01 or ASME SFA5.01 defines the way FM can be ordered to provide a level of QC that meets the purchaser's needs.

I hope I am answering your question.

Best regards - Al
Parent - - By Tommyjoking (****) Date 03-04-2013 03:54
hah ha ha....
Parent - By Nalla (***) Date 03-04-2013 15:06
Dear Al
Thanks for the explanation but
PMI required on Non-Carbon Steel Welding Consumable-Electrode / Wire -Required PMI. pls refer attached.
I want to know how to get it done during/after receiving the consumables and document it
Thanks
Attachment: PMI.pdf (18k)
Up Topic Welding Industry / ASME Codes / PMI on Carbon Steel Welding Consumables during receiving.

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