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Up Topic Welding Industry / Inspection & Qualification / doing research on PQR/WPS
- - By kennymox510 Date 09-26-2019 05:04
hi everyone,

i am currently the QC manager/CWI for a contract company working in California in a refinery.  Our welders are currently working under the clients stamps.  they test and qualify our welders.  this is all fine and dandy except those welders are now limited to welding for our company ONLY at that facility.  the company is planning to expand and look for more work at other facilities.  we would like to get away from having the client "own" our welders and start testing/qualifying our own welders.  this would also involve creating our own weld procedures as we currently use the clients weld procedures.  just like many other companies, the higher up management does not understand or put any value in our QC program and think a monkey can do it. (i"m sure they could, but id love to see the monkey answer a prosecuting attorney when something goes wrong).  that being said.  they do not understand all the work that goes into creating your own procedures.  i as well do not fully understand what it takes and that's what brings me here.  its not my job to do any of the above but i am taking the initiative on my own to try and educate myself as well as bring it to their attention that this will not be an overnight change.  below is the biggest issue i am having trouble finding an answer on.

Can i adopt someone else's weld procedure and PQR? or is that a copy right issue? i am assuming that i can take someone else's WPS and use that as the base for having someone make a weld to then create the PQR off of.  but can i simply copy and paste someone else's PQR/WPS and put my companies letter head on it?  i feel stupid even asking that and feel like the answer is "absolutely not" but i cant find any thing that states whether this is allowed of not.

thank you all very much for the help.
Parent - - By SWN1158 (***) Date 09-26-2019 10:43 Edited 09-26-2019 11:07
If your contract requires compliance to AWS D1.1 Structural Welding Code, regardless of who writes a PQR or a WPS, they must all follow and meet the same criteria... so, in that regard, they’re all essentially alike anyway. D1.1 contains sample forms that many companies use. The issue that could arise from using someone else’s, is the forms being filled out incorrectly, and therefore don’t satisfy the all the requirements of the code.
Parent - - By kennymox510 Date 09-26-2019 11:15
I should have mentioned. This would be for B31.3 and 31.1
Parent - By LToca85 (**) Date 09-26-2019 12:25
I am pretty sure taking another companies WPS and PQR and just calling it yours is called forgery.
- - By 803056 (*****) Date 09-26-2019 15:27 Edited 09-26-2019 15:30
Whether you are welding power piping or process piping, you are required to qualify the WPS by testing or there are provisions that allow you to purchase a Standard Welding Procedure Specification under a licensing agreement with AWS. Be aware that while the SWPS may be listed by ASME Section IX, it may not be permitted by the particular construction code (B31.1 or B31.3).

The first step in the process is to purchase a copy of the current editions of ASME Section IX and the pressure piping codes you will be working with. Looking first at Section IX, Article I assigns the responsibility for developing a company's WPS's to the company performing the work. Article II will describe the requirements of how the WPS is qualified. Keep in mind that the codes do not describe the steps or "how" to qualify the WPS. Article III defines the testing required to qualify the welder. Article IV includes specific requirements that come into play when referenced by the other articles. Article V lists the SWPSs that are recognized by ASME and what steps must be taken to utilize the SWPSs for production.

The construction code will provide additional requirements and restrictions regarding welding. The need to perform post weld heat treatment and when CVN testing is required is defined by the particular construction code. It will also state whether a SWPS is permitted for production welds.

With regards the SWPSs, they are not permitted if the welds must be PWHT'd or if they are required to meet CVN requirements.

If you need some training in regards to qualifying WPSs and performance qualification, there is a 3-day seminar coming up in mid-October on the subject. You might consider attending it. Look under the heading Education/Training of this forum. The seminar is titled "The Atlas of Welding Procedure Specifications".  I believe LToca85 attended the seminar. Send him a PM, I'm sure he can tell you his opinion on the seminar.

Best regards - Al
Parent - - By LToca85 (**) Date 09-26-2019 19:01
I did take the class and it was great I definitely recommend for anyone to take it, I went in there without a clue as to what to do regarding WPS and PQRs and I learned a lot. Even now that I kinda have an idea I would take it again, the atmosphere there is just amazing Al knows how to talk to you and get the information across. The material he hands out is a great resource and best of all you get to keep it, heck I use it all the time going back and use most of the resources he gives you. The people that attend the class have great knowledge and experience that you are just learning good valuable information anyway you look at it. Plus the food is pretty good I kinda want to go back just for the food lol.
Parent - - By 803056 (*****) Date 09-26-2019 20:41
Thanks for the positive comments regarding the seminar.  And I would be happy to see at another one.

Parent - By LToca85 (**) Date 09-27-2019 12:38
I would like to Al but I don't think my boss would send me way up there one more time lol
- - By DAC Date 12-09-2019 20:51
Hi all, I'm trying to find information on ASTM A434 BC grade 150 material for a PQR. I need to know what the group number maybe, I can't find in AWS D1.1 table 3.1. This would be a Raker Pin (A434) that will be welded to a ASTM A572 grade 50 plate with a 1/4" fillet weld. The electrode used was E71T-1C and I'm not sure if that is what should have been used. Any help on this would be greatly appreciated. Also if you can't tell, this is my first time ever posting anything.
Parent - By jwright650 (*****) Date 12-11-2019 14:20
I expect the reason that A434 BC Grade 150 isn't listed in Table 3.1 is due to the scope of D1.1 (specifically Clause 1.2) is for material 100 ksi yield or less.
You may need to use a different welding code such as AWS B2.1.
Parent - - By jwright650 (*****) Date 12-11-2019 14:25
Where are my manners? :eek: Welcome to the forum DAC. :cool:

No worries regarding your first post...gotta start somewhere.

BTW, Just as a Forum Etiquette type of thing, you should start a new post/thread rather than tagging a new post onto someone else's existing thread. Also this ensures that the replies and notifications are sent to you rather than the existing thread's owner.
Parent - By DAC Date 12-13-2019 17:29
Thank you for the response, I was wondering about how to do, as far as posting, thanks. I will take a look at the other code.
Up Topic Welding Industry / Inspection & Qualification / doing research on PQR/WPS

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