The need for trained NDT technicians

Date 08-14-2003 19:26

Ryan-
The best builder of confidance is to be there when they cut out the weld and see for yourself what you rejected.
I have had several opportunities to see, first hand, the discontinuities removed.
Once, x-ray showed a crack in a 68" dia. pipe. Now I know that no one wants to hear the "C" word and when I turned in the report, all hell broke loose. The Bechtal inspectors rained all over my parade- until they cut it out and saw the crack.
Another time, I rejected a weld using UT- the welder had already left the job and the repair fell to another welder (boy, did that make him happy) 3/8" deep and no air-arc, he ground down and measured 3/8, backed up and said "nothing there you f###head", I looked and saw a dark line in the bottom of the groove and told him to grind that line out- BAM, you would have thought the whole bottom fell out- a large slag inclusion.

Are your manufactured discontinuities helpful- yes, but seeing for yourself is best.

By jwright650 (*****)

Date 08-14-2003 20:12

When I was new to NTD, I had my first job UT'ing some column splices that came from one of our other plants. I was being watched by a Level II and I rejected the whole lot, all ten column splices had indications in every flange and web. My welders here at this plant had to fix these columns and they too were not happy. But seeing those indications come to life as they are being carbon arced out and not just as lines on a screen gave me the best confidence booster. Especially when they gouged exactly where I marked and cut only as deep as I indicated, bam, there they are in front of your eyes. Welded them back up and all indications were gone, another feather for the cap, because now I had the respect of our welders as well. I don't get the rash of crap when I find something now, they just let me mark it up and they cut it out.
Now when I re-upped my Level II an outside Level III was contracted out to test me for my next three year term as a Level II. He brought in a stainless steel plate 3/8" thick with a stress crack along one edge and in the middle that were only about a 1/4" long , 1/8" deep and invisible to the eye. All I had was my AWS D1.1 70 degree transducer and had to find these minute indications hanging half way off the plate. I found exactly what he said was in those prefabricated discontinuity plates, but man was it hard. I searched those plates over and over sweating to find all of them, not knowing what or how many, I was supposed to find. Anyway after exhausting my self and checking and rechecking these plates I drew on the report my findings. He sat amazed that i was able with the size transducer I had that I was able to locate all of those cracks. He recommended that I to my company that I could UT as a Level II for another three years.

Now that I see both sides of the discussion, I can say that I see benifits to both sides. Practice on fabricated indications is good if the practical experience is not available. But for me, I get to UT almost every day and I feel that I get enough practice detecting and sizing flaws.
John Wright

By UCSB

Date 08-14-2003 21:33

John-
We used manufactured calibration standards on SS in the nuclear plants while searching for IGSCC and interier weld contour on piping. Your right, Wright, that the AWS 'ducers would be tough to use. We used miniture 'ducers for all our ASME work.

Roger

By Inspector D Date 08-15-2003 16:46

Thanks for your comments guys. I definitely agree that the best flawed specimens come from parts taken out of service. Some facilities are keeping a few good examples on hand to show their guys and any contract techs coming in what they have found in the past and get their area of intrest in focus. That is so helpful for those inspectors dedicated to doing quality inspections. Another advantage of examining manufactured flaws is that we can control to a critical tolerance the size and extent of flaws like slag, porosity, cracking, lack of fusions so on and therefore an inspector can demonstrate their ability to be acurate in flaw detection, sizing and then interpretation regarding a code. I know the same goes for welders and inspectors, the good ones do not fear the performance demonstration. It is good thing for reputation and respect. I enjoy the dialouge about your experiences rejecting in the real world. Keep up the good work and be confident!
Check ya later,
Ryan

By DavidP66 (*)

Date 08-21-2003 19:49

I dont mean to bust on someone. But the website says they have kits that are cost effective. For example, one kit i looked at cost $29,900.00 for 5 pieces of pipe. I cant really see that as being cost effective. Personally, I think bookwork with pictures, hands-on training in school, shadowing a senior inspector, and OJT would make a more well rounded inspector. Just my opinion, but its just seems way to expensive for what you get.

David

By Inspector D Date 08-22-2003 18:10

David,
the example you pointed is our most expensive kit. The 5 specimen kit contains thermal fatigue cracks in dissimilar metal welds stainless/inconnel/carbon and a variety of geometric conditions and joint configurations used in the nuclear facilities. A customer would probably use this kit to qualify their inspection procedure to ASME section XI appendix VIII. Most inspection companies are looking for Lv.II inspectors who come with a few certs but a few are willing to hire assistants and train technicians. Our standard kits are useful for them and also popular with the technical schools offering NDT curriculum. the basic methods kit prices range from $1350 for the VT samples to $2100 gets you the RT kit. small price to pay for becoming familiar with a method and great for practice, but of course there is no substitute for on the job training and the guidance of experienced NDT personnel.
Ryan

By - Date 08-25-2003 03:17

To all interested - please see my post under this topic in the "Training" section.
Mankenberg