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Up Topic Welding Industry / Technical Discussions / filler material weight?
- - By Metarinka (****) Date 07-14-2008 18:00
Anyone have accurate information on GMAW wire weight by length. They sell wire by the pound, however wire feed is calculated as Inches per minute, our current setup would not allow us to accurately measure filler material weight (as their will be loss due to spatter) by simply weighing an unjoined and joined part. I was hoping there would be a simple chart showing wire weight by gauge and per length?

Trying to determine cost effectiveness of different comsumable and other variables, I know just about everything but consumable use in lbs.
Parent - - By DaveBoyer (*****) Date 07-15-2008 04:34
Steel weighs about .283 - .284 pounds per cubic inch. With an accurate wire diameter measurement You should be able to get pretty close on solid wire.
Parent - - By Metarinka (****) Date 07-15-2008 16:37
.01725^2 x 3.141...  x1"  x .283 gives me a density of .0002722 lbs/inch

That confirmed the 1 number I heard of .000275
now here's the question how many inches can you weld if your WFS is 648 IPM and travel speed is 29 IPM
I already know the answer but boy so many conversion calculations that need to take place. Glad I paid attention in physics
Parent - - By pipewelder_1999 (****) Date 07-15-2008 20:44
Are you making a 3/32" fillet weld or 3/8" or a groove weld?
Parent - - By pipewelder_1999 (****) Date 07-15-2008 20:45
You need to know the deposition efficiency of the process. Spray is more efficient than Short Circuit and Globular but the deposition efficienc will vary with the parameters you are welding.
Parent - - By Metarinka (****) Date 07-16-2008 13:20
yah I'm aware of that, I added in a fudge factor off of known industry standard. Unless the number is very far off it's within my margin of error. Those are 1/8"-1/4" fillet and groove welds. No one sizes or maintains weld size, so I just averaged it off of trials I ran on what 95% of the welding is. However the std dev between welders was very small
Parent - - By pipewelder_1999 (****) Date 07-16-2008 13:40
The how many inches is still a little hard to answer. I think of the deposition rate in Lbs per hour as opposed to a linear dimension. Once the deposition rate of the process is calculated, then the volume of weld can be figured and a corresponding theoretical "Arc Time" can be calculated.

The 1/8" to 1/4" fillet weld is a broad range. The 1/4" being 4 times more weld than the 1/8" however the 1/4" can be welded with higher deposition rates normally since the travel speed is high for a 1/8" fillet, Semi-Auto welding would be dependent upon the welders ability to move at high travel speeds.

Another consideration is production factor. How long is the arc on in an hour? or 8 hours. This can vary widely from employee to employee, welding machine to welding machine, and product to product. The production factor is higher for a 12" weld than it is for a 6" weld and also than for a 48" weld. The welder can maximize his time with a 12" bead. Start to stop without stopping. The 6" weld requires a stop every 6". The 48" weld may require a stop every 18".

So overall, many factors besides deposition rate would have to be considered to answer the question "How long....?"

In my opinion, controlling weld sizes would be needed since with fillet welds, twice as big is four times as much.

I hope this helps.
Parent - By Metarinka (****) Date 07-16-2008 14:05
oh hehe sorry that was a rhetorical question I had already answered myself. I was tasked with estimating welding cost, travel speed, arc on time etc etc. I was just checking my numbers because I realized I never verified filler wire weight in terms of lbs/inch (which goes directly into deposition rate).

Anyways I was using the averaged deposition rate and wire used to create a theoretical "arc time" the minimum amount of time you would need to burn all that filler and how long of welds you would create. I used this against total welding production hours and actuall length traveled to check for errors, finally we're also checking arc-on time by actual observation so as to cross check those numbers to see how they all add up. 

You're right about variance between welders though. The minimum observed deposition rate was 3.25 pounds (short circuit) to about 10.5 pounds for spray transfer. Likewise the minimum observed travel speed was 8IPM to 32IPM which is not good from a numbering average aspect. I was surprised the welder was able to sustain 32 IPM, maintain quality and do that repeatedly that's very fast for a manual process in my understanding.

Anyways I'm still crunching some of the numbers mostly checking figures and increasing sample size etc. That variance in travel speed was all on identical parts which is what is so shocking, that's a 4 fold increase from the slowest to the fastest welder. My next step is a little bit of training to reduce variance and maximize parameter efficiency so people aren't running so slow.
Up Topic Welding Industry / Technical Discussions / filler material weight?

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