In House Testing for D-1.1 Structural SMAW & FCAW

By pipewelder_1999 (****)

Date 11-05-2008 18:19

Unless your companies quality system or customer requirements dictate a second party, one is not required.

With some codes its REQUIRED that you do the welder testing and the only part you can sub out is the mechanical testing, RT, or preparation of the test specimens.

Other codes MAY require a 2nd party to witness the testing but I am not familar with them. There is probably some FEMA or AISC document floating around that has that requirement.

Is there something in D1.1 that leads you to believe an outside party is required ?

By R Mitchell (*)

Date 11-05-2008 19:24

not specifically. we do not have out side customers.what iI am reading from is from th standards for aws welders and under the topic of provisions for testing it has some specific info about test facilities. that is where I was concerned. my shop is the maintenance facility for our company. we do everything from structural fab / install / repair on crane booms ect. the need for cert. papers is necessary and i have always tested my own and only draw the question due to possible paranoia. i just dont want to make a mistake with liabilities. I was reading another post where people were talking about a lab that let you mail the test to him and he sent the papers back and alot of negative opinion came from some of the replies. that was supposed to be from the internet.

By swnorris (****)

Date 11-05-2008 20:43

If you want to become a CWI just for qualifying welders in house, it really isn't necessary. The structural code deems that a person is competent to perform inspection and accept or reject materials or workmanship, if that person is qualified by training or by experience, or both, in metals fabrication, inspection and testing. If you fit this description, set up a jig in accordance with D1.1 criteria and perform your own testing. The preparation of bend test coupons and the acceptance criteria for bend testing is in D1.1. The basis of inspector qualifications should be indicated in the contract documents as to whether a CWI is required or not. I've been doing this for years based on experience alone and have never had an issue. I write PQR, WPS, and qualify welders. There may be some who say this could be a conflict of interest, but if you follow D1.1 to the letter, you know that you've done everything you're required to do. As for liability, a welder cert. only means that a person welded good enough that day to pass the test. To me, the liability kicks in when a someone realizes there is a problem with a welder not following code or contract requirements, and does nothing about it. On the other hand, a welder could do everything properly and there could still be a service failure. If that's the case there would be design issues, but everyone involved would still be dragged into the lawsuit and then the legal system would sort it out. Anyway, if you go this route, keep the accepted test coupons and identify them. If anyone questions a welder cert., you can always show them the actual coupon.

By R Mitchell (*)

Date 11-05-2008 21:00

that is part of the reason as well as the fact that I do all of the structural steel and welding acceptance and rejections for the company I work for.as far as the bend testing I have everything RT inspected in a lab for unlimited certifications and they keep all of the coupons at there facility. Thank you and everyone else for the info.

By welderbrent (*****)

Date 11-05-2008 23:52

Ron, I have several comments and am not sure where to start so will just list them as they come to mind:

1) You mention crane fab, install, and repair- would you also be certifying to D14.1 as it applies to cranes? In conjunction with D1.1.

2) Are you referring to AWS QC7 for certification registration of welders when you commented about AWS standards for welders? I have seen very few companies utilize that program, if it even still exists, though I have a copy of it myself. Most of the CWI's I talk to don't even know what it is. Probably only used if you use an AWS certified test facility, which a lot of them don't seem to be. They are certified through other agencies to test and certify welders.

3) The process you mention where you test and send the coupons out for RT is perfectly allowable, though a lab I have used asks that I fill out and sign an affidavit as to all the info/code, process that the test was run to and who ran it. They take my word for that part and they test the coupon and 'certify' the welder to whatever pre-qualified procedure I specify. Keeps things more above board for customers and inspectors though not totally required as mentioned by others who have responded.

4) I would personally prefer a bend test for this application to an RT. Possibly do both if you want to see what is in there. But the bend test will better prove the ability of the welders to put in a weld that will handle the proper stresses for the application that it is going to be used in.

All I can think of for now. Time for this crew to head home.

Have a Great Day, Brent