New CWI Stamps

By fbrieden (***)

Date 07-23-2009 19:01

I have no problem!

By bmaas1

Date 07-24-2009 00:20

I still use my old one.

By Joseph P. Kane (****)

Date 07-24-2009 03:25

Golden Arm

I am the one on the Certification Committee who pushed for it to be red. It cuts down on a lot of counterfeiting via copiers.
Yes, new color copiers can get around the color change, But, not all cut and pasters are that smart, because they are usually already starting from a B&W copy.
The Inspector should always ask to see the original.

(I think it is hilarious when someone hands me a cut and paste forgery with my name and stamp on it!)

The new one has an expiration date on it, which the Certification Committee deems to be most important.

You always could use another color for your stamp. I had stamps in red and green for several years. Whoever at AWS told you you couldn't have a different color was wrong. I have also made myself a subsize stamp.

Finger staining was recognized as a problem by the Committee, but was deemed to be a minor problem that anyone who was smart enough to pass the CWI exam could learn to avoid.

Joe Kane

By Golden Arm (*)

Date 07-24-2009 13:59

You mean to tell me the Certification Committee actually addressed the intelligence of the inspector in the redesign of the stamp?

I like the new stamp itself, I just don't like the carrier. It seems destined to break. I also approve of the color change. It should have happened years ago because I don't find it amusing to see my stamp being counterfited. Anyone other than myself won't readily recognize my accompanying signature and it can be difficult to reestablish a reputation if it becomes damaged thru theft of a stamp.

By Joseph P. Kane (****)

Date 07-24-2009 17:00 Edited 07-25-2009 19:40

Golden Arm

No, the Certification Committee did not really address the intelligence of the inspector in the re-design of the stamp. It was a comment I had at the time that everyone else on the committee was complaining about getting "redfinger". (I still get it once in a while.)

I did not like the new carrier either. Staff said they could not get the old button type metal stamp carriers anymore.   I had a source for the button cases, but that was not listened to. The new carrier was the most compact pocket stamp we had to choose from during the evaluation and decision making process. By the way, the ink is not indellible.

The real "amusement" I had, was a case when I was excoriated for rejecting all the welds on a high school gymnasium expansion by the contractor. He called down the school officials to get me removed. I had color macro photos of the best and most egregious welds. When the contractor finally furnished the welder qualification records, I pointed out that the signature and stamp on the welders certificates were mine! I also showed the contractor and the school officials that the welding position qualification block said "2-F" (good for flat and horizontal fillet welds only, and not in the 3-G, 4-F and 4-G positions on the welds in question.). I also had a record of every qualification paper I ever issued, and showed that the papers presented were forgeries. I also showed this to the School Officials, who came down on my side.

True satisfaction came when that contractor hired some welders with NYC Welder's Licenses. They removed the bad welds, and deposited nice, code compliant, new welds. The contractor and the School Officials (Non-Welding civilians) could readily see the difference. The contractor later apologized to me, explaining that he had been mislead, and didn't know how bad the welds were until he saw the new ones.

Then I went to do a post weld inspection on a completed and sheetrocked vaulted roof rehabilitation, in another school, in the same school district.   One of the school officials had been up in the vaulted roof area during that welding, and remembered that those welds did not look like the welds produced by the NYC Licensed Welders. The official ordered that contractor to cut open spaces for me to conduct an inspection. When I took more pictures and rejected most of those welds, the contractor rebelled and threatened to sue, etc.

The school officials would have none of it. They showed me more welder qualification paperwork that was obviously poorly and incorrectly filled out and not signed off by anyone.   I suggested (In front of the Contractor) that it was time to consider filing charges for "Offering a false instrument for filing".
All the sheetrock was removed,and repair welds took a week and a half.

I am amused, because shoddy contractors who didn't give a damn about the weld quality in a school, got caught and had to take money out of their pockets to complete their contracts. The testing lab I worked for at the time still gets business from that and other school districts because of those incidents. The lab also gets their concrete, masonry and soils work because of it.

The first contractor has also had me comment on other welder qualification paperwork for other contracts since then. He became a real believer. So, I think his apology was sincere.

Now, this does not address a counterfeited stamp. That is something different altogether.

Joe Kane

By Duke

Date 07-24-2009 12:02

They don't do so well in the laundry, either.

By Lawrence (*****)

Date 07-24-2009 12:35

Right on Duke!

I washed my Red CWI stamp thingie not that long ago..

Beside upsetting my beloved wife and ruining a bunch of cloths.. It was sorta difficult to refill the little ink pad thing-a-ma-jig

By 803056

Date 07-24-2009 15:31

I'm one of the dummies that can't use the damn thing without getting red ink all over my fingers. Personally, I think they suck.

Best regards - Al

By Superflux (****)

Date 07-24-2009 18:51

The new stamps design are another one of those ingenious solutions to a nonexistant problem. When I recieved my new one, I had stamped some docs. and of course inked my fingers, then rubbed the corners of my mouth and chin, met with the Union B.A...looking like I'd had a turbo attack on a 5 lb bag of red pistaccios! I then discovered that Office Depot can make a nifty self inking model (just squeeze and stamp! really cool tool!) and they have the AWS logo on file.
Way back when, I used a cut-out disc from a red inkpad and inserted it in the old round metal stamp case. My complaint then, was, I'd bent the metal case and it was difficult to pry the toggle out and seperate the 2 pieces...nothings perfect.

By 803056

Date 07-25-2009 17:03

Why would Office Depot have an AWS logo on file? I believe the AWS logo is protected by copyright/trademark laws. Only those authorized by AWS to use the logo are permitted to do so.

For instance, a Sustaining member company can use the AWS logo on their company's paperwork. They pay for the privilege to use the AWS logo.

A CWI can use the AWS CWI stamp with the AWS logo, but I'm not so sure it is permissible for any inspector to use the AWS logo or produce a replica of the AWS stamp. Again, I believe the stamp (shape, size, etc.) are protected by copyright/trademark laws. As for color, even that is covered by copyright/trademark laws. A trademark must include the colors of the trademark when an application is filed with the government.

Best regards - Al

By Superflux (****)

Date 07-25-2009 20:27

Al,
Oops my mistake...While cruising across town to another store last night I noticed that the supplier I used was Office Max (in Billings, MT). Why or how they have this in their files, I have no idea, this is just what the clerk at the counter told me when I picked up my "custom made" stamp. I was informed that the price was lower than the original quote due to their having it in archives. Perhaps they have altered it in some manor to circumvent any copyright infringements.
Anyways, I do like the new stamp they made me. Squeeze to open, stamp the doc., squeeze to close.

I guess the Ethics and Certification Departments will be sending in the Shark Pack my way now...

Will l still be able to maintain my CWI and AWS membership while incarcerated?

By 803056

Date 07-25-2009 20:46

As long as you are inspecting the welds securing the bars I see no reason to question your relevant work history.;)

Best regards - Al

By jrw159

Date 07-28-2009 12:24 Edited 07-28-2009 15:21

Al,
I ran across this issue a while back and had inquired about making my own stamp. I thought I had posted the info I received from AWS then but I can not seem to locate it with a search. So, rather than post off of memory, which sometimes lets me down, I called AWS and asked the same question again. This is what I was told.

You can indeed have your own stamp made through places like Office Depot/Office Max and others that do this sort of thing but you must follow a few guidelines. It must be the exact same logo with the exact same info on it. IE certification #, expiration date, and location of these. Essentially, it must look exactly like the ones they make. This may be why some places have the logo on file. One thing I forgot to clarify was the size of the stamp itself, but I would think that if everything is the same, then if it was enlarged so as to be seen better, it would probably be OK.

However, if one goes out and does as this guy did, look out. LOL

http://www.aws.org/cgi-bin/mwf/topic_show.pl?pid=113675;hl=bogus

jrw159

EDIT: After speaking with AWS again, the logo can not be enlarged. NO NO.

By jrw159

Date 07-28-2009 13:01

Now having said that, it begs the question "Are the people like Office Max who have the logo on file know of the guidelines?"

From the evidence in the link I provided, evidently not. Or they chose to ignore them.

I would think there should be repercussions for the people that manufacture a fraudulent stamp as well as the person using it.

But I digress, that is another subject all together.

jrw159

By welderbrent (*****)

Date 07-28-2009 14:34

John, and others,

Two points if I may:

1) Yes John, you did post it somewhere. I remember reading it. Can't find it either. But I know I have these problems with computers, what's your excuse? I think it was in the thread that started after an article about people being investigated and things to watch out for that was in the 'Inspection Trends' about 3 months back.

2) Ran into an inspector a while back, we were both in the same shop on different jobs, and he had bought one of those stamps that the imprint rotates down off the inkpad and stamps then spring takes it back up and onto the inkpad again (I hope everyone knows of what I am speaking, don't know how else to describe them). He then took his CWI stamp and removed the plate from the cheap holder and I believe super glued it into the rotation stamp. Made it so much easier to stamp multiple pages than having to close and open the one they send us so many times and kept his fingers clean.

Granted, if we are free to have them made that may be easier. Then just keep the original as a backup. Just thought I would throw that out there for some of the cheaper yet more enterprising amongst us.

Have a Great Day, Brent

By jrw159

Date 07-28-2009 14:41

Brent,
LOL, I have yet to come up with a good excuse and can not think of anyone but myself to blame it on, so....oh well, you get the picture. :-)

When I called this morning to inquire about this, The nice lady I spoke with says to me "Why don't you just wait a couple of month's? You will get a new one when you renew." I informed her I was aware of this but that I would like to have one like you have described for my desk. I had thought about doing something along the same lines with my old stamp, but it is the old style that does not show the expiration date so I believe I will retire that one in a safe place for a keepsake.

jrw159

By welderbrent (*****)

Date 07-28-2009 14:52

John,

Maybe I should clarify as well. By 'old one', or 'original' (don't remember how I worded it, oh my, don't go there) I meant the current one that was copied to have the office supply make a nice one. So it would be valid to use if you forgot the larger easier to use model. Yes, we would have to have a new one made every three years since the expiration date is on them. But, they don't really cost that much.

In your case, it would still be better to wait till you get the new one no matter what. Not wise to make one now and again in three months.

Have a Great Day, Brent

By jrw159

Date 07-28-2009 15:06 Edited 07-28-2009 15:22

Brent,
My intent is to have two of them. The smaller portable one that AWS makes and a larger "flip type" as you described that would stay on my desk possibly enlarged just a bit for easier viewing. If not for that, yes, there would be no sense in making one when I only have to wait until October for mine. :-)

jrw159

EDIT: The logo can not be enlarged. Must be exactly the same as issued by AWS.

By 803056

Date 07-29-2009 17:34

Thanks for the good information on the CWI stamps.

Best regards - Al

By Golden Arm (*)

Date 08-03-2009 17:46

Well, I did it again....... stained my fingers that is, and not only that, I inadvertently transfered some of the red ink to my document.... gotta reprint it now.... and restamp it. Maybe I should re-evaluate my abilty to use this stamp. It's hard to imagine, for 21 years no problems with a CWI stamp now.... I don't know.

By bmaas1

Date 08-05-2009 02:43

Am I correct to presume that you can still use the older ones?

Brian

By eekpod

Date 08-05-2009 10:20

When I stamp my documents, I try to put the stamp over some other text just a little bit. This way it can't be copied and cut out becasue there will be other "stuff" in the copy. This will help avoid some scammers.

By flamin

Date 08-05-2009 15:42

That's a good idea, I never really thought of that.

Jason

By Golden Arm (*)

Date 08-05-2009 12:20

I'm pretty sure won't want to use it. To date I haven't seen anything from AWS since receiving my new stamp telling me not to use my old one. You'll like the new stamp. It looks nice and it has the added benefit of the expiration date on it. I just don't like the carrier. It's pretty cheap and until you get the hang of it (assuming you are smart enough to use it LOL) you'll more than likely get ink on your fingers and documents.

As a side note I began the practice years ago of initialing my stamp across/along the upper left diagonal in red ink to help prevent counterfeiting and theft.