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Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Ac power from a SA 200
- - By argoncowboy (**) Date 11-14-2009 16:00
I have a 56 SA 200 in the shop right now. I am looking for a way to get AC power from it. I have heard of guys bolting a pullied generator onto the motor to get AC power. Do any of ya'll know where I can locate on, or do ya'll have any other suggestions. Thanks.
Parent - - By nevadanick (**) Date 11-14-2009 16:19
You can put a larger or additional alternator and battery, and use a 3 or 4000 watt inverter.
Its good enough for most 110v power tools
Parent - - By weldwade (***) Date 11-14-2009 16:35
The inverter is the cheapest way to go. I agree with Nick and I do have a 75amp (I think) alternator on mine and a 3500W inverter. Works great for an el chepo inverter I picked up at Wal-Mart.
What kind of work are you doing? How much aux power are you needing?
Parent - - By argoncowboy (**) Date 11-14-2009 17:11
I'm building compressor pads, so the bulk of my AC power would go to grinders then a fan in the summer and a heater in the winter.
Parent - - By weldwade (***) Date 11-14-2009 17:58
The heater would be the big user. I have a little 750W heater that I use and it's like a fart in the wind but better than nothing I guess. I would say to get at least 3000W. One thing to look for when buying one is the continuous output rating. If I remember correctly there is a thread on this subject in the SA200 forum.
Parent - - By weldwade (***) Date 11-14-2009 18:15
http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=5301540

This is the one Kaye Sellon from Bills recommends.
Parent - - By argoncowboy (**) Date 11-14-2009 21:42 Edited 11-14-2009 21:45
I picked up a 3500 watt inverter a while back that I have on my truck, It works very good. I was wondering if there was a bolt on generator that I could retro fit onto my machine, in case I have to put it on a sled
Parent - - By weldwade (***) Date 11-14-2009 22:28
An AC generator is going to be fairly large and expensive. Your engine may not be able to handle the extra load it would require. You can mount an inverter inside your machine to allow you to run it on a sled. The inverter is by far the cheapest way to go. Personally I have never seen an auxillary generator on a SA machine, anything is possible though. Hydraulic drive would be possible and use the least amount of the engines capacity.
Parent - - By argoncowboy (**) Date 11-14-2009 23:47
Thanks Wade, I didnt know which way would be the most economical. I also didnt realize the auxiliary power generator would be so bulky. Thank you again for your input
Parent - By DaveBoyer (*****) Date 11-15-2009 05:29
Not trying to start an argument, but a hydraulic driven generator would be the least efficient of all.

Generators will require 2 HP on the shaft per KW of output. The problem is building a drive that can handle the torque and give the proper shaft speed. Most generators in the 3 KW range are wound to run 3600 RPM to give the 60 HZ You need. This means You will need large diameter pulleys on the engine, as it is only turning 1500 RPM.

An inverter supplying 1800 watts [15 amps @ 120V] will draw 180 amps at 12 volts. While the battery will provide enough power for short perids of grinding, continuous use of a powerfull appliance will soon drain the battery.

There is NO WAY that the high output alternators will provide their rated output at welding RPMs as they are rated at MUCH HIGHER shaft speeds [frequently 6,000 RPM]. To get full output, You will need to drive it with a greatly oversize pulley on the engine.

For heat aplications, consider heat lamps, or a coil heater that has no fan, as they can run from the DC Aux. power on the machine.
Parent - - By KSellon (****) Date 11-19-2009 04:46
I like the Marine grade one at Bass Pro better, but wally worlds isnt too bad
Parent - - By weldwade (***) Date 11-19-2009 06:04
I will check them out the next time I go to the big city. K'mon kids were heading to Bass Pro... "Do we have to stay there all day again dad???" lol             
I need one for the boat so I can plug in the blender.... Margaritas make the tops drop;)
Parent - - By KSellon (****) Date 11-21-2009 16:41
note to self --do not go fishin with Wade.. or just stick with beer...
Parent - By weldwade (***) Date 11-21-2009 17:44
Ok I'm writing it in my little black book... If Kaye comes to Sunny Az for a cruise on the boat, BEER only!!! for the first day at least.lol
Parent - - By chris2698 (****) Date 11-22-2009 15:25
you know they make gas powered blenders?? I knew a girl who had one boy that was the best dam blender ever would blend in a couple of seconds here it is http://www.totallygross.com/ and this one but way the hell more http://www.blenderblaster.com/blenderblaster/
Parent - - By DaveBoyer (*****) Date 11-23-2009 03:00
Down in the islands We called those "Hurricane Blenders" as You can keep the hurricane party going after the power goes off.
Good for islands with no power too.
Parent - By chris2698 (****) Date 11-23-2009 03:04
hell it's good anywhere lol
Parent - - By joe pirie (***) Date 11-14-2009 23:59
WHY NOT JUST BUY AC/DC TOOLS THEN YOU DON'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT IT
Parent - - By weldwade (***) Date 11-19-2009 06:00
He is wanting more power than the 200 has available.
Parent - - By Cumminsguy71 (*****) Date 11-20-2009 23:48
Talking about alternators those guys running all the big booming stereo's in their junk have some mega output alternators on them. I've heard about 200+ amp alternators, custom jobbers also with custom signage in front $$$$$$$$$$
Parent - By DaveBoyer (*****) Date 11-21-2009 02:43
If You want a good 200 amp alternator, get a Leece Neville 200 amp truck alternator. It is BIG and will make the power and hold up, not some sooped up 100 amp car alternator. These are not cheap either, but You might be able to get a remanufactured one. It will pull 5 1/2 HP, that takes (2) 1/2" belts.
Parent - - By KSellon (****) Date 11-21-2009 16:42
2 and 3 battery back up, also
Parent - - By nevadanick (**) Date 11-21-2009 17:09
AC power ? Isnt that what those blue things are for ? :)
Parent - - By KSellon (****) Date 11-21-2009 18:34
the rolling boom box cars have high output alternators and extra batteries (blue things??)
Parent - - By nevadanick (**) Date 11-21-2009 18:43
millers
Parent - - By Cumminsguy71 (*****) Date 11-21-2009 19:03 Edited 11-21-2009 22:48
Another guy and I were talking and wondering why we could not hook our Sa's to our truck batteries? Just run a simple positive wire and use those. My dodge has two and nearly 1000cca each, should be plenty of battery for a machine with high output alternator, just don't know how that would/could affect the truck.
Parent - - By FixaLinc (****) Date 11-22-2009 00:50
Actually you can do that.  When adding extra batteries though for inverters to run appliances and power tools on though it's a good idea to use a battery isolator for the extra battery.  The battery isolator lets you use one high amp alternator to charge all your batteries.  If the one battery on the inverter or other high amp pulling accessories pulls down you still have the other battery charged that only runs your starter, lights, and vehicle ignition and accessories without pulling down both batteries that way.  Ambulances, fire trucks, over the road trucks have been using battery isolators to do that for years now it's nothing new and does work well.  Get a isolator that is rated a bit more than your alternator amps and the load you want to run on it.   

http://www.colehersee.com/04resource/tec%5EBatt%20iso.htm

You probably don't need a alternator with 250 to 300 amps but they are out there and not cheap.  An emergency vehicle with all those high amp flashing lights, cordless chargers, inverter, and other high amp drawing accesories won't work on one battery and a pissy ant 50 amp alternator. 

http://www.nationsautoelectric.com/ecotech.html

Parent - - By DaveBoyer (*****) Date 11-22-2009 05:35
Keep in mind that diode type isolators like shown in the link reduce the charging voltage by .7 volts. This doesn't sound like a big deal, but it does matter. To get around this problem You need to move the voltage regulators "sense" lead to the output side of the isolator, so it can read the true charging voltage and regulate accordingly.
Parent - By FixaLinc (****) Date 11-23-2009 02:24
That's why you need to match the correct isolator to your alternator.  Cole Hersee has had at least 3 isolators for a while now to use with the Delcotron CS alternators that have a 4th terminal on them that you connect terminal that is switched by the ignition switch.

http://www.colehersee.com/pdf/IFs/IF-128_Bat%20iso.pdf
Parent - - By argoncowboy (**) Date 11-22-2009 16:16
I have my truck batteries as well as my SA250 batteries wired into my 3500 watt inverter. It works very well. I like the fact that if I need power for a small task I dont have to cranck my machine to get it done. I've also noticed that my machine does not drag when cranking for the first time on a cold morning. I assume this is do to the truck keeping a full charge on the machine.
Parent - - By DaveBoyer (*****) Date 11-23-2009 03:06
The way You have them hooked together You are cranking the welder [and the truck] from all the batteries.
Parent - - By argoncowboy (**) Date 11-23-2009 11:36
Yes sir all three batteries are tied together. The only problem that I've ran into is when I use my inverter for an extended period of time without cranking my truck or machine. It then drained all three batteries. From what I'm reading about the isolator mentioned would remedy that.
Parent - By DaveBoyer (*****) Date 11-24-2009 04:02
The isolator alows charging batteries while keeping them seperated electricly from each other for discharge. It won't keep from draining all the batteries if You still have them all conected to the inverter.

You really need a lot of battery power to run the inverter for any length of time with a larger load. I used 6 golf cart batteries on My boat with an 1800 watt inverter. I could bake a lasagna for an hour and a half in the combination toaster oven/microwave. That takes about 1200 watt hours of electricity.
Parent - By 63 Max (***) Date 11-23-2009 05:13
I've had my SA 200 hook to my truck battieres for years. It works great and I never have to worry about it starting in cold weather. I dont even have a battery in my welder.
Parent - - By nevadanick (**) Date 11-22-2009 14:14
never mind ha ha i dont think your gona get it
Parent - By nevadanick (**) Date 11-22-2009 14:18
ive seriously considered buying a little trailblazer just for their 10000 watt ac power, plus i could get one with ac weld output and have the ability to tig alum in the field, with a hi freq box.  It could also serve as a backup just to get a job done incase my sa250 took a crap.
Parent - By KSellon (****) Date 11-23-2009 22:11
hehe
Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Ac power from a SA 200

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