sourdough says:
It's every employers job to beat down the workers emotionally, and financially, so they don't ever go onto anything better for them and their families....it's good business these days!
I say:
No not really. No doubt some do, many don't.
As an employer I've always figured MY job was to find really solid hands, give them work they completely understand, supply them with the most efficient methods and tools available, keep the work in front of them, pay them more than THEY think they're worth, and watch the good things happen.
That, and grill on Saturday. And ice a watermelon every day for break time.
Other employers take different paths but mine has kept everybody content, loyal, well paid and well fed for several years. If we can't have fun doing welding stuff then what are we gonna do for a living?
dbigcahunna is right, a working man brings his skills and enthusiasm to the employer (at whatever level they are) and trades them for dollars to feed the family and fuel the Harley (only to feed the Harley if he's single : )). Not abuse (as already mentioned that's a trip to the hospital for some bosses), not yellin, not stupidity. Those bosses aren't going to get any more than the minimum effort out of any hand. Minimum effort never equals maximum profit.
Those jobs usually pay low, get low. Treat hands poor, get poor hands.
Safety trumps price even in this economy because safety IS price. Bid low, get the work, hurt a couple men on the job and guess what, your price just went thru the roof and nobody even bothers to start a lawsuit at a million anymore so I really mean thru the roof.
Lawyers are uber expensive, workmans comp more so, bad press kills in terms of $$$ and future work. So the safety ($$$) factor plays into more than any employee understands.
Got an old school foreman who wants to clock a guy on the job? Get ready to lose your insurance max in court (after it drags out several years) and give up all future work.
Not to say they're not still out there, but they won't survive much longer.
J
Just my take based on my observations, experience and upbringing.
Your my kinda guy JTMcC.
Your spot on the safety as well. We have companies we work for that we have to submit our safety numbers every quarter to retain the job we do for them. We cannot be above the industry average for more than a quarter or our $$ goes down.
By JTMcC 
Date 05-15-2013 20:42
Edited 05-15-2013 21:01
I've had customers where a small scrape or cut, that only requires a bandaid, results in a court of inquiry. Everyone present at the time is interviewed seperatly by a "commitee". And they would ban a contractor at will over too many scrapes and bruises.
It's a money thing to them.
My two employees who work the most for me are my Son and my best friend. They (the owner) don't understand that I take the hands safety more serious than any company safety man ever will because it's not a money thing to me, it's a moral thing, and I really like to sleep at night.
Even if a guy is working for me that I personally don't like, I'm not going to do anything to get them hurt.
As my favorite safety sticker says: We only come to work, we don't come to die.
I've never seen a welding job that was sooo important that a man/woman should get hurt over it. Show up on time, earn your pay, enjoy the work day, go home at night. That's about it. I've banned myself off of sites where that wasn't possible in spite of the $$$ involved, it's never worth it. Maybe that's why we aren't filthy rich : ) : )
J
Well, it must be different in Colorado. Aside from being treated shabby, you get pushers who shave hours or per diem off your pay....so that they get their bonuses. Don't know how many times in the last year and a half I actually got paid without having to dispute my check.
JT, if you treat your hands with respect and dignity...that's awesome. I'm just saying that I haven't been treated that way. I've been treated like its some kind of privilege to bust my ass, be top dog welder, and make the company money. I've actually been told on starting day once that there's a hundred guys just like me standing in line for my job. I replied, "then let's see what you get", and promptly hopped in my truck and blazed. His ad for a qualified welder is still running, and is 6 months old now. See what I'm saying? There are a ton of people out there who are either socially retarded, or just plain ignorant when it comes to respecting another man. It shouldn't matter if you sign the paychecks. If I show up on time, rock out the layout, slam stuff together, and throw down some killer welds and a lot of feet per day.....should you not appreciate that and treat me like an asset, instead of an expendable commodity?
This has been my experience in the last year or so. You guys who understand that we are all human, and who are discerning and witty enough to be the juggler behind the scenes....my hat's off to you! Some people just don't have enough sense to run a business efficiently. Unfortunately I have run into a bunch of folks who oughta have jumper cables applied to their nuts.
And....it is true what was implied about me not being one of those guys who can't just be a worker bee. Totally true. I'm an innovator, a thinker, and a hustler. I like to work as efficiently as possible, and make money doing that. I don't enjoy doing that for a smaller wage, unless the outfit I work for gives me the freedom to be who I am. I'm good at what I do, and it hurts a little when an employer is scared to let me know it for fear of my head getting big. My other rig is close to being finished....so you won't hear me whining about this topic much longer...(grin).
No, it's the same everywhere.
One thing I know, the farther up the food chain you move, the less BS the welders have to deal with.
I don't build tanks but from the tanks I've been around it's a world with lax specs and inspection and I'm not dogging on tank welders.
Harsh (fair) inspection and harsh (fair) specs thin the air considerably. There is more money there, better conditions, fewer competitors, better bosses, better everything. Certainly not perfect but better.
In work that almost any low to mid range welder can do, it gets very muddy and then you have the proverbial 100 welders lined up at the gate. I know there are people making a fortune in residential railings, and good bosses there too. But they are a lot fewer than in fields where skill capable welder are few and far between.
I've seen welding jobs that required run of the mill skills where a good welder was appreciated, treasured and rewarded, but I've also seen top of the line, no repair welders in harsh fields tossed. So there are about 3.75 million factors in play but higher levels of skill/inspection/specs almost always helps the man holding the stinger.
No matter the level of work, the Human Element will never go away tho. There hasn't yet been a perfect welding job and there never will be. If there is I'd like to be on it : ) Not holding me breath tho.
J
Not to beat this to death, and I probably am, let's say this:
Say I don't want to be a welder I wanna be a fireman.
Ok, I can go down to the local volunteer fire dept. They love me, I can bring a big grill to their cookouts/fundraisers and I'm a Superior Grillmaster Supreme. I can drive a big truck off road. I can hold a hose, run a shovel, put strobes on my truck and I'll show up fast in the middle of the night. There are a lot of guys who can do the same (except grill as good as me).
Or, I can go down to the Palo Verde Nuclear Power Plant and try to become a firefighter there. Totally different story now. The highly qualified aren't lined up knee deep here, the labor pool is shallow.
Both guys can be a great human being, both guys can have a sorry boss. Both might be very good at what they do but the latter usually will have a better chance at good conditions and more appreciation for his/her efforts and certainly more $$ per hour. I'll quit now.
J
Well....I may have found a good boss....working 70 ft in the air under induction fans at a coal power plant. Good steady breeze, all kinds of elbow room, and a good handshake and "thank you" at the end of inspection day.
