Snowden - Right to Privacy

Date 08-07-2013 21:43 Edited 08-07-2013 21:51

I am amazed that more people are not voicing their displeasure with our government with regards to their "secret programs" of domestic spying. Between the NSA and the Patriot Act, living in the US is more like living in the USSR they used to tell us about when I was in grade school. They want to know what books we are reading, who we are talking to, and where we are driving. Secret courts, secret trials, imprisonment without charges being filed, what the fuXX! All of this secrecy in the name of protecting us against terrorists threats? The terrorist have already exceeded their wildest dreams, they won Buttwipe! I am more fearful of this government than I am of Al Qaida.

I question the truthfulness of everything Washington Officials say. Just about everything they have told us have been lies. They foiled a bomb plot because of their spy programs, but they could not get Benghazi right? Really? If they foiled a bomb plot it was by accident, not by grand design.

The lies perpetrated by the Bush and Obama administrations have only been admitted to when they are revealed by Snowden. We suspected as much, but the government officials lie and assured us they aren't spying on us. Snowden told the truth and Obama and the rest of Washington are upset they got caught spanking their monkey in the closet. This government is spying on friend and foe alike. Snowden is a hero in my book. He should be celebrated by every citizen in this country for revealing the lies and secret programs authorized by the Washington political hacks. He would be just another shmuck were it not for the liars in Washington. Now Obama has refused to meet with Putin because Russia has given sanctuary to Snowden. Good for Putin, shame on Obama.

I knew old George was a lying SOB, but Obama is turning out to be just as bad.

As soon as the President or his cronies (that includes the Republicans currently in Washington) open their mouth you have to assume they are lying to the citizens of our country. John Boehner and Obama deny everything until they get caught with their pants down around their ankles and their legs spread for stability.

If politician tells me it is a sunny day I’m going to turn on the lights in my house, find a flashlight if I go outside and bring an umbrella with me because sure as dirt, it will be dark and raining.

Check this site if you would like to voice your opinion about the current administrations attempts to harness our right to privacy. https://poll.personalliberty.com/Poll.aspx/snowden-poll-2013?SC=P22598330&gclid=CKyQ--ak7LgCFQee4AodNGYAbA

Wow, that felt good!

Al

By welderbrent (*****)

Date 08-07-2013 22:09

I concur wholeheartedly. And trust me, most of you know Al's stands and many also know mine. For the most part we are political opposites. But I agree. Things are so obviously crossing party lines that on most issues, especially privacy and freedom, you can't trust ANY of them, Democrat or Republican.

And it isn't just the Benghazi and Patriot Act listening issues. How about their spying on a free press? How about Fast and Furious? How about a secure border? How about unreasonable discrimmination toward certain groups seeking tax exempt status (not just Tea Party groups, there have been churches and other institutions included. And it doesn't matter what we may think of tax exempt status in the first place, preferred treatment of some while demanding extra of others is wrong)?

Here is the bottom line: There is not one part of this you can totally lay at any one party's feet. Somewhere along the line, they have both been heavily involved. There are both parties represented on every committee. The whole body of Congress may not have been informed, but some were.

And I'm glad for brothers here who are willing to cross party lines and cry foul. This is getting out of hand. They need to all be replaced ASAP. It's time to stop playing games and thinking any one of them is still okay. None of them stands guiltless.

Have a Great Day, Brent

By MMyers

Date 08-08-2013 13:11

I have been following the whole thing pretty closely since the story broke. One thing has struck me funny: if I talk to my friends, most of them don't seem to care. The level of apathy I'm seeing is kinda disturbing. I think alot of them either just want to "buy into the Matrix", think someone else will fix it, or are afraid they'll get labeled and put on a watch list. Reminds me of an old Benny Frank quote: “A Republic, if you can keep it.”

The online community is pretty vocal though, but I think it's a very few number of people making alot of noise.

By 803056

Date 08-08-2013 13:40

With all that is going on I lean toward they are afraid of being placed on a watch list. Even I gave that consideration before posting my comments. It is simply a sad state of affairs in Washington and no one in Washington can claim their hands are clean.

I believe there has to be a certain level of security, but I don't believe any US citizen has authorized this government to intrude in our daily lives or agreed to give up our right to privacy.

When queried about security matters a simple comment to the effect that they neither confirm or deny there is a specific program in place is one thing, but to state that no such program exist is an outright lie and I believe those that lie to the American public and congress should be held accountable. Simply put, I don't trust a liar; they have no right to hold a position that requires ethics, morality, or honesty. They belong in a cell beside other criminals.

Al

By MMyers

Date 08-08-2013 14:44

I tend to agree. I am very careful of how I word stuff because I am far from a radical, but I am concerned and I feel communicating that is necessary.

By 522029

Date 08-09-2013 00:05

To all so far responded:

Keep your heads stuck in the deep sand for you know nothing about which you are speaking.

Enough said here.

Good bye
Griff

By 803056

Date 08-10-2013 15:09

If keeping one's head in the sand is comforting, keep it there Griff. You seem comfortable not knowing the truth and you are more than welcome to stay here. It is suppose to be a free country, so you are welcome to speak your piece.

Some of us don't like to have smoke blown up our ass and then be told it is for our benefit.

Al

By 522029

Date 08-10-2013 16:30

Dear Al.

Please re-read my previous post in order to find whose head is stuck in the sand.

Bye
Griff

By 803056

Date 08-10-2013 17:05

My apology. Open mouth, insert foot.

Al

By lo-hi

Date 08-14-2013 00:51

Just thinking about the difference between Snowden and Jane Fonda and their treatment by our government. If aid and comfort to the enemy was not prosecuted in a time of war then why should condemn someone who is trying to help us. good rant Al Perley

By Tommyjoking (****)

Date 08-15-2013 13:00

lo-hi that is a pretty good point!

By 803056

Date 08-07-2013 21:55

1) Do you think Edward Snowden is a hero?
   19% voted: No, his actions have harmed U.S. interests and its position in the War on Terror.
   75% voted: Yes, the U.S. government overstepped its boundaries spying on its own citizens and he is a hero for exposing it.
   5% voted: Not Sure.

2) Do you believe mass government collection of phone records and internet searches make America safer?
   16% voted: Yes, large scale government spying programs are necessary to keep American’s safe.
   81% voted: No, large scale government spying is turning America into a communist country.
   4% voted: Not Sure.

3) Do you believe government spying on American citizens is illegal when it is done without probable cause or a warrant?
   84% voted: Yes, American’s have rights from illegal “search and seizure,” NSA spying violates those rights.
   13% voted: No, it’s naïve to believe that in this day and age our government can keep us safe without some sort of surveillance.
   3% voted: Not Sure.

4) Edward Snowden had made it clear that he has more government secrets to expose. Do you believe Americans have a right to that information?
   14% voted: No, I trust the government does what they do for reasons to secure our country and our way of life.
   80% voted: Yes, I believe full disclosure is warranted after learning just a little of the surveillance activities the government has perpetrated against its citizens.
   6% voted: Not Sure.

5) Which political party do you most closely align with philosophically?
   13% voted: Democrat
   22% voted: Republican
   12% voted: Libertarian
   15% voted: Tea Party
   27% voted: Independent
   12% voted: Other

By weldwade (***)

Date 08-14-2013 01:49

First off I agree completely with what everyone has said so far and I say a thank you to all who have commented. I really appreciate this thread! Makes me happy to see others who think as I do. I could go on for days about what I think is wrong and how I think we need to fix it. To put it simply and as short and sweet as possible. I think we need to look to the past for guidance for our future. We better wake up and damn soon or we will feel the pain! Our Government is completely out of control and we need to do all we can to reverse this toilet bowl ride we are in.

My views are extreme and I would certainly derail this if I keep talking.

By Superflux (****)

Date 08-10-2013 21:03 Edited 08-10-2013 21:07

Remember,
"Everyone has an FBI File. Some are thicker than others..."

Really all this has done is confirmed what we should have known or suspected.
Darnit, now I'm on a watch list just for responding to this!

BTW, I'm sure he has violated the nondisclosure forms he signed when hired. I signed a many of them prior to employment as a Defense Contractor. So, yes he is undoubtedly subject to prosecution, right or wrong.

Attachment: BeaRatFink.JPG (0B)

By Tommyjoking (****)

Date 08-11-2013 02:24

ahhh F**K the watch list....I will stand by my actions or words in front of any court in these borders. I have done not good things in my past and have been super lucky...I have learned things and grown up and I still feel I have the RIGHT to say whatever the hell I please. That is ONE of the things my family has fought, bled and died for. I won't shame them by being afraid of some stupid fad of some stupid administration or series of them. Are your rights being violated by some geek at a computer terminal in Virginia...probably...are you actually going to suffer because of it...I really doubt so. The only thing that disturbs me about all that jazz is the Govt hiring private individuals to do the work with little oversight....I am sorry but I would much rather have an FBI agent looking up my anus with a flashlight then some recent college grad-I got a degree so give me a job jerk off like Snowden.

The Endeavor the goverment is taking on with these executive orders BUSH pushed thru is a very daunting task indeed. Did anyone forget the entire planet changed in the last 20 years pretty radically as far as communication goes.....the public in general is learning how to use and not to use it, commercial enterprises are in a learning period as well.....well guess what the Govt is trying to figure out how to take advantage of it and do it within the law as well. Screw the administration in power, give a break to the folks actually trying to do the work.

NONE of us in this conversation know the truth of it or the whole story. If what they are doing saves a life or many...it is a worthwhile endeavor.

If you are worried about it being 1984 finally coming to pass....well there is nothing wrong with those concerns....that kind of worry, thought and vigilance is what will prevent 1984.

My $.02

By Smooth Operator (***)

Date 08-11-2013 20:31

Tommy.......How big of a flashlight do you think they use ??????????? :eek:

Like I said in previous posts" One thing about our government they don't discriminate....once your in their sights your screwed/they will screw anyone.......... :yell:

By Cumminsguy71 (*****)

Date 08-12-2013 03:37

I think most people won't say anything because they have either been beaten down and have given up, rolled over and are playing dead or they are scared when it comes to actually standing up.

Quick tangent, I have always been pretty opinionated. Worked at a dealership. I would here groans and moans all the time. At one meeting with lots of complaints gathered I raised my hand to express the feelings that 95% of the shop had. In the end NOBODY backed me up. My willie was left hanging in the breeze to be chopped off. When the SM asked if anybody had anything to add you could have heard an ant fart. After that my stand has pretty much been f'k everybody else.

I think that is probably part of the problem with our government and the people. Half the people in this country are bleeding my arse dry off my tax dollars and the government keeps asking me for more. Good example of this is "Surfer Dude" out in California. Has no job, surfs all day long and has no intention of getting a job. He is and has been on unemployment and public assistance for who knows how long. He eats lobster and all manner of fine foods on a daily basis. Meanwhile I work, my wife works and my dear Uncle Sam rapes my arse to support people like this. I work more and then pay more while staying in the same situation. The other half of the country works getting more depressed because they keep getting arse raped. Their complaints go unanswered up on the hill while the meat head at Pennsylvania Avenue goes on another pricey vacation paid for by me while my vacation is sacked for yet another year. Tours shut down at the "People's House" because our government can't afford it. Wait? How much was Obama's vacation to Africa a few months ago? $1.6 million?? Christ almighty, wish I could afford a G D $1000 vacation!

The IRS, yeah, I'll say it. They suck. Dirty scoundrels. Abolish that whole outfit, flat tax but us citizens have been saying that for years and it appears to fall on deaf ears. Meanwhile the IRS plays favorites, the Obumble says, "no they're not". Then throw in the fact that everyday or at least week we find out something new about the Obumble care and how it is going to cost us more and more. Another pet project rammed down the throats of the American public. Voted on by people who are supposed to be like us.

Corrupt, lying s.o.b's up there in D.C.

Snowden, I think he is a hero as well. One guy who stood up and said, "hey, that's not right". We have "oversight committees" that are supposed to watch over certain things but it don't help if they are as corrupt as what they are overseeing! Like I said in my post about Snowden. If you think that the government has not been watching you for a long time then you need to pop that bubble you've been living in.

Our government is definitely screwed up and has been taken over by self serving people. What can you do, nothing. Complain to somebody and maybe they'll listen but most likely your message gets dumped in the ole file 13. Kinda like dealing with contractors and calling them, getting ahold of the secretary running blocker. Same type of situation.