We just recently had a customer audit of our AWS D1.1 and D1.2 processes. The auditor had a finding that derived from his interpretation of AWS D1.1 Section 4.7: Preparation of WPS- The manufacturer or contractor shall prepare a written WPS that specifies all the applicable essential variables referenced in 4.8. The specific values for these WPS variables shall be obtained from the procedure qualification record (PQR), which shall serve as written confirmation of a successful WPS qualification.
His statement of the observed condition: "PQRs have a range documented for voltage and current. The current (Amps) is listed as 80-170 A and 21-24.6 V on the PQR and WPS. This should be a specified single current on the PQR, and a range of +/- 25% of the Amp value on the WPS."
My question is: On the PQR, do the amps and volts have to be documented as an absolute value or is it ok to document them as a range (Per AWS D1.1, D1.2, or D17.1 Standards/Requirements)?
Explanation of what we do: We do document on the WQTR, the absolute values that were used during the test. Once the weld has passed all required tests for qualification, the WPS and PQR is established. On the PQR, we document a range for the amps and volts based on the actual values recorded on the WQTR and the +/- % of Table 4.5 in AWS D1.1. So...Our WPS's and PQR's have the exact same information for these two essential variables (amps/volts) documented on the established forms.
AAGGHHH!!
First, WELCOME TO THE AWS WELDING FORUM!!
Second, PLEASE, don't ask the same question in multiple locations, especially when one was on the back of a year old thread. Thank you for starting your own thread, it will contribute to keeping questions and answers cleaner and on track.
Third, now I will have to see what I can find in between doing nightshift inspections. Hopefully someone else will be able to answer quicker.
Have a Great Day, Brent
I apologize for the misuse of the forum as this is my first time to use one. I posted the one in shop talk first then realized that was the wrong place to do so. Anyway...If anyone could please give me clarification of documenting the values on the PQR, I would greatly appreciate it! BTW, we use a 3rd party CWI, so i have been racking my brain and resources trying to figure out whether the auditor is correct, or correct on some levels...did our 3rd parts CWI document the wrong values on our PQR's based on the recorded values of the test....AWS B2.1 Sample PQR says "Current (Range)________ and Voltage (Range)_________".....AWS D1.1 Sample PQR has the absolute value recorded for pass/layer 180 & 200 but the WPS has the range as 180-220 so why does it have a % increase and not a % decrease... any these are just thoughts/questions as I am researching for clarification of this finding....
Which welding process are you using?
What page of D1.1 did you find the sample PQR?
I want to provide some info but I would like to know those 2 answers first.
Thanks,
We have GMAW and GTAW procedures for D1.1 and D1.2, all of which have been qualified by testing. Our 3rd party CWI did all of our PQR's the same way, the volts and amps as ranges. The sample pqr in D1.1 is in annex N on page 356 with the wps on 357....and for AWS B2.1 the sample pqr form is on pages 273-274
Take a look at your other posting of this up under 'Shop Talk'. Al responded to it there. He had a similar situation in the recent edition of 'Inspections Trends'. An AWS publication for inspectors. If you have access to it you should take a look at 'The Answer Is' dept on page 22. Goes into more detail than he did here.
Have a Great Day, Brent
Thank you Brent! I will take a look at that publication as well.
If anyone else has any opinions or would share with me how they document their PQR's, I would appreciate it. In researching this topic I have seen statements like "the actual values should be recorded on this document" so I am still a little undecided on what to do........
1. List each/all value(s) used during the test on the WPQTR and on the PQR and then take the average of these values +/- % to document the WPS range....
2. Take the average of the values used during the test and document the one value (average) on the PQR and the WPS same as #1.....
3. Using the recorded values during the test, document the range of these values on the PQR (80-170) with 80 being the lowest current used and 170 being the highest current used....then take the -% from the 80 and add the +% to the 170?? (this option I'm not real sure about it meeting AWS requirements?? or see #4)
4. Same as #3 but on the WPS use the average of the two numbers to calculate the +/- % and document this range on the WPS
I know I am making this more confusing BUT....I just need to know how most companies document the current/volt/travel speed on their PQR's and WPS's.
Thanks,
Traci
By welderbrent 
Date 01-17-2014 17:14
Edited 01-17-2014 23:22
Traci, (now I have a name to go with the handle)
It's not that you are making it more confusing, it is a rather complicated procedure. And it is greatly misunderstood and hard to communicate and instruct in this forum. You will get many diverse opinions (remember what those are) and applications from everyone you talk to.
You can also go to the AWS website and ... I'll get you a link instead of trying to guide you there. You can access ALL past technical inquiries and there may be something there in the D1.1 section. Otherwise, one of your best bets is to either get ahold of someone like Al for professional services or send in your own technical inquiry to the appropriate committee and be prepared to wait about 5 years for an answer. (Sounds like a terrible process but it takes time for the committees, which is a volunteer position, to get it all worked out, worded, checked by AWS lawyers and editors and then publish the decision.
I'll post that link in a bit.
Have a Great Day, Brent
Thanks Brent for all of your help!!
Traci
