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Up Topic Welders and Inspectors / Education & Training / Welding simulators, a new tool for educating young welders
- - By Henry 123cert Date 08-15-2013 19:11
Hi, my name is Henry, and I've been a summer intern at a cool company called 123certification Inc. They currently design and sell welding simulators.

I was just posting here to try and get some views and opinions about whether current welders of all different levels of serious (hobbyists, experienced welders, teachers and instructors) think this is a cool concept that you might be interested in, that you consider a constructive innovation that will improve welder training and that might garner more interest in young people to become welders by profession. Currently, 123certification's product allows you to "virtually" weld using 5 of the different processes including GMAW, SMAW, GTAW, FCAW and MCAW. Basically how it works is that you have a real weld torch attached to a machine with a screen, you put on a real welding mask that has 3D goggles built in, and you see yourself in a welding training room, and are able to practice welding with 9 different welding assemblies (more are being developed) including the T-joint, butt joint, lap joint in all positions.

Basically the concept of the simulator is to allow new welders to practice and learn in a safe and comfortable environment, and allow the college or program that is teaching them to conserve on materials and energy. So it is both a money saver and a tool that makes welding seem more accessible to young people. It is only getting better and more refined everyday, but it currently focuses on the basics and to teach the hand-eye coordination and manual dexterity required for all good welders. It is meant to build a strong foundation (and make the student feel comfortable) before proceeding to real and more complex welding. It also has built in a powerful instructor guidance tool that allows instructors to set up welds and create a learning program designed specifically for each student. It also gives extensive feedback on each aspect of a student's weld to show them where they need to improve.

I'm coming to these forums as a young person going into first year university, and I wouldn't be doing so if I didn't honestly think this is a very cool idea. I've been told that there is a large shortage of new welders worldwide, and I think this could be a way to garner new interest. I know that welding is a fundamental profession for human infrastructure and projects and robots will never be able to replace human welders, especially in cramped or on-the-fly locations like welding repairs on oil pipelines or underwater.

What do you guys think about this? Would you consider trying it yourself? Recommending it to new students?
Parent - By jwright650 (*****) Date 08-15-2013 19:14
How does this simulator compare to Lincoln's?
Parent - - By Lawrence (*****) Date 08-16-2013 14:27
The simulators I'm aware of cost between 35 and 50 thousand dollars each.

There is Zero conservation happening at a price rate like this.

How much steel, gas and power can be purchased for this cost.

The cost of that single piece of equipment exceeds the annual salary of a significant fraction of welding instructors sadly.

Can they shorten the learning curve?      Yes.

Will you save money or materials by usisng them.. No.
Parent - By jwright650 (*****) Date 08-16-2013 14:31
I agree Lawrence...the ROI is too far in the future to ever be of any value.
Parent - - By TimGary (****) Date 08-19-2013 12:54
The last Lincoln simulator I used only worked half the time because someone had dropped the hood.
The $10K replacement cost was deemed too expensive...
The virtual reality simulators are OK, but in my opinion, way too over priced with small benefit.

I am highly impressed by EWI's "Real Weld System", and intend to get one soon. ($35K -$40K)

http://www.realweldsystems.com/

Tim
Parent - By Lawrence (*****) Date 08-19-2013 19:39
Tim,

I have used the EWI "Real Weld" also..     It is the best tool in my opinion... But if you had a pocket full of money I suppose you could have a couple of Lincoln simulators in the classroom and a couple of EWI's out in the hot work area and really shorten the learning curve.

If somebody offered me a grant to buy them I would snap it right up... If I had to budget them,,,, it's not gonna happen.

When you can buy 7 to 10 actual welding machines for the price of one simulator... It's just hard to justify.

Also,,, I don't see single simulators working in a classroom environment...  You need a number of them so that you can teach a group of students a thing... run them through the simulators to get the motions and angles and then put them out for hotwork....    Running one student at a time, especially with the short class periods of most high schools and colleges and the semester is over before Jonny gets his turn on the cool simulator...

If weld simulators were the same price as an X-Box  or a Wi (same technology) then I would be on the rooftops encouraging everybody to get 5 of em.
Parent - - By welderbrent (*****) Date 08-16-2013 15:14
First,

Every system I've seen falls short of Lincoln's unit.  Sorry, I'm not a died in the wool Lincoln man but they have the best one.  Just saw several up at Fabtech Las Vegas back in Nov, 2012 and they don't cut it.

Second, I agree with Lawrence.  The pay back is extremely long in my opinion.  Especially with many of the schools I am aware of who get many consummables donated; steel, etc.

One place where I think they do payoff, AWS Truck touring the country and promoting welding as a career.  One of our larger but independent welding suppliers here in AZ bought one and set up a mini van with it and travels the state to schools, fairs, and other events at their expense promoting welding, Lincoln, and of course, their business.  They are a great supporter of AWS, welding, education, and the SkillsUSA events. 

Have a Great Day,  Brent
Parent - - By 803056 (*****) Date 08-20-2013 23:58
But can they replicate the smell of seared flesh and the agonizing pain that accompanies hot slag rolling down into one's shoe?

Al
Parent - By welderbrent (*****) Date 08-21-2013 03:46
Forget the shoe, how about the one that hits your neck, rolls all the way down your shirt goes down past your belt and lodges ....  Well, you get the idea.

And no, I don't think any of them duplicate that feeling, smell, or experience. 

Have a Great Day,  Brent
Parent - By pipewelder_1999 (****) Date 07-25-2014 21:19
I know this is an old post but I just want to mention Soldamatic by Seabery.

I went the AWS Welding Conference for Educators. Most of the conference was presentation and questions. But the last presenter was a company from Mexico. http://www.soldamatic.com/ and the product they had was for Augmented Reality Welder Training . I have experienced the Lincoln Vrtex360 and Realweld trainer. Both of these are interesting. And in my opinion the realweld is of use for what I want to do. But both are 30-40k ish right now. This company showed up and in my opinion Blew Lincoln, Miller and Realweld away just because of the features and price.
I do have a realweld and feel it has some capabilities that just cannot be achieved with the VR or Augmented reality. But as a tool to help prepare students for welding without welding, The Soldamatic is IT. The welding is close to realistic, supports multiple processes, the coupons can be put ANYWHERE you want. The coupons are plastic with imprinted QR codes and anywhere you put the coupon you can weld.

I really want to get my hands on one for more time. But if you hear about one being in your area, you should check it out.
- By hvymax (**) Date 10-22-2013 16:32
Or down you collar into your underwear. I have used the Lincoln and am truely impressed. At the AWS tech meeting it was like a video game with people competing for the most perfect technique. My facility has one now which was down with a dropped helmet but is back online now. I need to adapt my future classes to better incorperate it. Where they really shine is they give constant feedback on a persons technique. The class can watch realtime and see where others have issues and correct. It is a lot more interactive than having people crowded around one person welding. The scoring also plays to the video game competitive nature of many younger welders as well. This way they come to the booth with an idea of what they are trying to accomplish saving me a lot of time watching and correcting techniques.
Up Topic Welders and Inspectors / Education & Training / Welding simulators, a new tool for educating young welders

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