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Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Welding Problems
- - By Pacco Date 09-19-2005 15:12
I had an idea to fix a problem with ac/dc welding leads but from the replies i recieved it isn't really a problem. I am looking for any type of problem that is common in the welding field if anyone can enlighten me it would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Parent - By CHGuilford (****) Date 09-19-2005 16:34
I reviewed your previous post you referred to. I'm sorry but between that and this post, I have no idea as to what information you are looking for. Maybe you could explain or re-write your question?

Chet Guilford
Parent - - By billvanderhoof (****) Date 09-20-2005 05:16
Are you looking for a subject to write a paper on?
Bill
Parent - - By Pacco Date 09-20-2005 23:05
I am looking for a problem that can be solved with engineering. It is for a class called Engineering Design and Development and the whole class is basically finding a problem and solving it by use of engineering.

This idea was mentioned to me by a person who helps with a welding class. He explained how the duty cycle tells you how long you can weld without striking a new arc and if you go over this the windings inside the machine can be messed up.
Parent - - By Kamaruzaman (*) Date 09-23-2005 07:50
may be you can see a magnetizing formations in automatic weld. sometimes of beveled end problems too. or to enhence incomplete fusion problems.

the mobility of welding torch and cable at the elevated area in fabrication yard/areas

etc.

is it okay to you...?
Parent - - By Pacco Date 09-23-2005 15:15
When you say magnetizing are you refering to when you are welding and the metal is magnetized causing the arc to go to one side?
Parent - By Kamaruzaman (*) Date 09-27-2005 02:17
That true.

One things is about spatters. Since welding in ac current has more spatters than dc current.

Weld beads appearence is looking good compared to ac weld beads.
Parent - By Kamaruzaman (*) Date 09-27-2005 02:33
but most of the time magnetizing is come from beveled end activities. (some J or U groove is rotor machinning). And most of the time you are need to demagnetize prior welding. If not, lack of fussion will happened.
Parent - - By brande (***) Date 09-24-2005 06:06
In my experience, 30 years, FWIW, problems are rarely solved by engineering.
Most problems are caused by engineering.

brande
Parent - - By - Date 09-24-2005 11:12
Brande,
With all due respect, I think your assumption is totally unfounded and you cannot provide any data to back up your statement. Speaking from a Welding Engineer's perspective, in my 35 years experience I have seen almost 100% more problems solved by Engineering knowledge and actions than created. For you to say "most problems are caused by engineering" is false. Thank you.

Chuck
Parent - - By QCCWI (***) Date 09-24-2005 12:01
I never thought I would say this but I agree with Chuck the Engineer.

I have been woking in a fab shop for a long time.I have said many times if the engineer had to build it he/she would not design it that way.I only say,not because the design is wrong,but because it is complicated and takes time. In my line of work time is money.

I have never in all my years in this fab shop called an engineer with a problem on a drawing that he/she was not willing to look into and change if it is feasible.Just the other day I got a drawing showing 2 peices of plate 1/2X1'X1' standing up,with a 3/4 gap between them, calling for a 3/8 weld on both sides of each plate.I do not believe any welder can put an effective weld between those plates.I called the engineeer told him what I thought and he changed it to a partial pen weld from one side.
I have never been told by an engineer that is he/she is not going to change how it was designed. My personal opinion is a problem on paper is not really a problem. When the peice of steel is fabricated and is sent to the field then does not work that is a problem. 9 times out of 10 the peice is fabricated wrong and not designed wrong.
Parent - - By swnorris (****) Date 09-24-2005 14:18
We've always had great relationships with engineers. As fabricators, we very often have ideas and suggestions that we are allowed to proceed with by the engineer. These ideas and suggestions allow us to deviate from the design drawings, or in some cases shop drawings, but still maintain design criteria and meet applicable codes. This is mostly done prior to releasing a job to the detailer. I have a better opportunity to do this compared to other production managers, because I'm also the drafting manager. Before anyone starts thinking hmmm... production is in charge of drafting, and the fox is in charge of the hen house... It's not the same thing. Any good fabricator wants to provide a successful project to the owner and at the same time wants to maximize their profits. The engineers we deal are open and very receptive to our ideas and suggestions, and 99% of the time they approve them. This helps us increase our profit margin, and without EOR approval, this would not be possible. It is sometimes forgotten that the folks that design, bid, fabricate, and erect are all part of the same team, and the success of any project depends on communication between the team members. It is important for the EOR to listen to the fabricators and erectors because they have practical knowledge which is not taught in college. The engineer gains this knowledge from them on his day to day experiences of putting together his projects, and the fabricators and erectors gain knowledge from the engineers as they get answers to their why's and why not's.
Parent - By - Date 09-24-2005 14:57
Scott,
Hey, my friend, you're on a roll today. :-) This is another great answer. You made the correct point that we are all a team..the Welding Engineer, the welders, the QC, the fitter, etc.) We all contribute by providing expertise in our own field to make any project a success. To categorically place blame on one field of personnel was almost an insult. The Welding Engineer, the welder, the QC Dept., or any other contributor, cannot singularly accept credit nor blame for the success or faliure of a project. One cannot work or be successful without the other. Scott, I just wanted to thank you for saying what many of us already feel. Good job to you and QCCWI both and thanks to you both.

Chuck
Parent - - By brande (***) Date 09-24-2005 16:28
Chuck-

Just a little shop floor humor...

I really meant no offense here.

I've just found in my travels, a great deal of problems on the shop floor.

Wrong welding symbols, designs that don't allow room for the welding gun, and so on.

As there are good and bad welders, I'm sure there are good and bad engineers.

Parent - - By - Date 09-24-2005 16:32
Brande,
No problem. The most important thing is that we can all voice our opinions in here and still walk away not mad at each other. Thanks for your response.

Chuck
Parent - - By RonG (****) Date 09-26-2005 16:23
I guess thats why when folks are having troble deciding whether the glass is half empty or half full the Engineer thinks the they have the wrong size glass, The only problem with that is sometimes you gotta explain to them what a glass is.
Parent - - By - Date 09-26-2005 16:47
Hi Ron,
Maybe I'm just having a blonde day, but I don't quite understand your analogy. Sorry.
Parent - - By RonG (****) Date 09-26-2005 19:48
Are you an AGGIE? Not sure if you are putting me on or not.

Just having some fun at the Engineers expence.

There is a list (sent around via e-mail) of analogys about how Engineers see things. If I can find I will post them for you.

One goes like this; If one peson see's 16 Oz glass with 8 Oz of fluid in it he see's it as half empty where as the fellow next to him says it's half full.
Along comes an Engineer and explains they have the wrong size glass.

I just added my $.02 because Engineers have a tendency to work close to minimum requirments while (they say they are) trying to error on the side of caution.

Parent - - By - Date 09-26-2005 20:29
Ron,
It was a joke. I was kidding with you. Believe me, I know most of the Engineering jokes, and even laugh at most of them. :-) I understood what you were talking about, so I thought I'd bring some humor into it, too. And, no, I'm not an AGGIE. An Aggie definitely wouldn't have understood it..LOL..
Parent - - By QCCWI (***) Date 09-26-2005 20:56
Just wondering but are Aggies and Cowboy fans the same thing?
Parent - - By - Date 09-26-2005 21:06
Well, since I'm not an Aggie, I would think a Cowboy and a Longhorn (Univ. of Texas) go more hand in hand. You know, Cowboys and Longhorns....Just sounds better than Cowboys and Aggies..:-)
Parent - - By OSUtigger (**) Date 09-27-2005 03:48
Awww, see, now its turning south. I can stand someone making fun of engineers...I can stand someone making fun of my welding...heck, I can even stand someone making fun of my dog...but don't try to place me on the same level as a longhorn fan (notice the non-capitalization, this is intentional...). Like momma always said, it's all fun and games 'till someone gets compared to a longhorn...
Parent - - By - Date 09-27-2005 13:03
When I mentioned Cowboys, surely you didn't think I was referring to OSU Cowboys. No, I was referring to the Dallas Cowboys and Texas Longhorns, 2 winning teams. ;-) Of course, there are a lot worse things than being a Longhorn fan...(Sooners, Cowboys, Golden Hurricanes of which my nephew is head line coach). Hey, maybe the Golden Hurricanes aren't so bad after all. Good luck in your studies at OSU. ;-)

CM
Parent - By RonG (****) Date 09-27-2005 14:53
HOOK'EM
Parent - - By QCCWI (***) Date 09-27-2005 14:54
Did I read that right? Did you put Dallas Cowboys and winning in the same sentence?

Personally I think the Longhorns would beat the Cowboys by at least 40 points.

Oh by the way I was just kidding about the first part.
Parent - - By - Date 09-27-2005 15:16
No, actually you are right. The 'Horns most likely would beat the Cowboys. I was just ribbing OSUTigger a little bit. Ever since Jerry Jones bought the Cowboys it has gone downhill. Granted he won 2 Super Bowls, but it was with talent he inherited form Tom Landry era. So, all I can say is Hook'em 'Horns... ;-)

P.S. The Cowboys are probably terrible welders, too.
Parent - - By OSUtigger (**) Date 09-27-2005 17:00
Ahhh, ambiguity...certainly a flaw of modern society. Because I grew up less than 8 miles north of the border, I am sure that we could get into several Texas-Oklahoma jokes (some of which I would be the butt of from both directions), but I will have to refrain due to the cliche' excuse: I don't want to have to explain them 3 times over. :-)

I must admit, though, you guys from the Republic of Texas (I am convinced that it is a whole different country, and I don't mean that in a bad way) seem alright to us Pokes, just as long as we agree on one thing: Beat the Sooners!

Yall have a good one!
Parent - - By - Date 09-27-2005 17:14
Tell ya what...Y'all take care of business and beat them and we will do the same. Boy, will Stoops cry a river of tears. Go 'Pokes and 'Horns.. How's that??? ;-)
Parent - By OSUtigger (**) Date 09-27-2005 18:28
AGREED!
Parent - By ebbb1092 Date 09-27-2005 16:53
Hello,

My name is Eric from Montreal.
I have a quick question concerning welding of magnesium using TIG, may be you can help me. The thing I want to weld is a Lower Fork section (Outer Cylinder) of my Mountain bike suspension. The Part got punched during a downhill and I have right now a small crack (.75'' long ) in Lower Fork which is made from Magnesium (?? alloy unknown ?, Rock Shox won't tell me, wall thickness around 0.060-0.100'').
I know Magnesium can be weld using TIG and Mag rods but my ''local'' machine shop tried and failed. Magnesium part started to form small holes. Do you have a trick ?

Merci

Eric B.
Parent - - By JTMcC (***) Date 09-27-2005 23:19
Wow, a guy can't make a little funny around here can he?
Sounds like a batch of SSTSED's (Super Sensitive Thin Skinned Engineer Dudes) to me.
Inspectors goof on the welders, the welders goof on inspectors, and both goof on the engineer. This is sacred tradition (and has been since before most of you old coots were born) and anybody that can't deal with it should never venture outside the safe confines of the office lest his/hers finer sensibilities be scuffed a bit ; )
I (and evidently only I) got the funny.

JTMcC, a rather thick skinned welder, who knows better than to mess with sacred tradition chuckling quietly to hisself.
Parent - - By ebbb1092 Date 09-28-2005 00:50
U right i'm a Enginneer, I'm impressed !

You got big mouth but do you have the answer ??

Eric B.




Parent - By JTMcC (***) Date 09-28-2005 01:31
Eric B. my comments have nothing to do with your magnesium welding problem, I'm addressing the above mentioned "engineer wars" ; ).

You're right tho I do "got big mouth."

I'm not sure how your question relates to the thread, you might get an answer if you post the question as a new thread.


JTMcC, battle scarred 20 year veteran of the engineer wars (both theaters) , still chuckling quietly to hisself, but slightly shaking his head now as well : )

editors note: those stupid little smiley things mean that if you're getting mad about my post, you're taking it too serious.
Parent - By - Date 09-28-2005 02:41
JT,
I'm an Engineer and got the funny, and even participated bringing it on even farther. But, an SSTSED, I think not. An old coot... well that is closer to the truth.. ;-)
Up Topic Welding Industry / General Welding Discussion / Welding Problems

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