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- - By 803056 (*****) Date 01-03-2007 04:01 Edited 01-03-2007 04:07
Well Folks, what do you think of the new web site?

I, for one, don't care for it.

Why don't I like it?
1) you have to register. A major turn off. I rarely return to any site where registration is required. I have enough spam in my mail box as it is. Once again, AWS is more interested in serving their marketing department than their membership.
2) I had a difficult time finding my happy place, this forum.
3) The old home page was a pain in the butt to find certain things, but this new and improved home page is definately a big zero. Does anyone at AWS understand why we return to the AWS or any other web site. No? Let's make it more difficult to use than it already is! The number of users that will return will plumet. Let's make the nonmember even less likely to return to the AWS web site.

Some of this was discussed at the last Certification Committee meeting and everyone spoke out against AWS Marketing Department's bright idea of having every user register to gain entry to the AWS web site. Hello, is anyone listening?

I guess the secret is to add the forum to my list of "Favorites" and skip the AWS Homepage altogether.

Enough of my rant.

Best regards - Al 
Parent - - By ftgokie Date 01-03-2007 05:32
I personally dont like it...its really cheap looking, but the registering for me isnt that big of a deal. I just save it to my favorites under welding forums. I HATE how when you reply to a post, it throws it to the right.....its a big pain for me.. I tried to get to the forum from the AWS site and found it hard to get to it....so i just went in my history and found it. Lots of info here, but with the bad parts, I dont see myself as being a regular...just 2 many steps to get to where u wanna go..my 2 cents
Parent - By Cgregory (**) Date 01-03-2007 15:50
Just as an FYI, the forum software and forum website has not been changed and was not affected by the change in the main AWS website at all.  We are looking at different options for forum software.  I completely agree with you about the replies to a post being thrown to the right getting annoying, and that's one factor that we're absolutely considering with any new forum software.
Parent - By ross (***) Date 01-03-2007 18:20
You can help prevent the "throwing to the right" problem by going to Options and under "Display Options", change "Indent (1-10%, for post threading)" from 3 to 1.

Ross
Parent - - By old-N-ugly (*) Date 01-03-2007 08:00
Hey they don't even have a link to the forum, how ridiculous.. :(
Parent - By billvanderhoof (****) Date 01-03-2007 08:05
If you click on "services" on the home page it opens a menu with "forums" on it, click there and you bypass the login.
Bill
Parent - - By jwright650 (*****) Date 01-03-2007 11:25
Al,
I have a link in "my favorites" for this forum and never have any need to visit the Main page, I just click my link and come here and as long as I haven't dumped my cookies, I can enter without having to login each visit. The new Main page is different for sure, and I have to admit that I haven't been using it enough to know whether or not I find it any better or worst. I need to find time to get in there and look around more.
Parent - By jon20013 (*****) Date 01-03-2007 12:39
I happen to agree with Al, I HATE the new website and have told any who asked.  That said, I believe it's going to be jammed down our throats like it or not.  Unfortunately it is driven completely by marketing... I wrote Admin yesterday about the "links" problem and was told the system has a bug which affects IE users (probably 99.8% of us) and they're trying to work it out.  Dunno the reason behind change but so often things seemingly change just for the sake of change and are seldom made better... msn and hotmail along with IE7 are good examples in my own experience...
Parent - By Joseph P. Kane (****) Date 01-03-2007 12:51
I have already answered the poll in the lower left hand corner.  I do not like the new format either.  This is a real loser.
Parent - By chall (***) Date 01-03-2007 13:43
The truth is I didn't like the old format.  I don't particularly care for the new format, but I did find it to be easy for me to read the topics quickly to decide whether or not I am interested in reading the full article.

The bottom line for me is I have a quick link to the forum and only occasionly go to the main website.

Charles.
Parent - - By ross (***) Date 01-03-2007 15:12
Hi folks, I'm one of the guys working on the new website. Sorry you don't like it.  A major problem is the bug with Internet Explorer which just popped up late in development and we are fighting to fix it ASAP. This messes up navigation to the forums and other resources, so it's a big deal and I am very embarrassed. We'll switch back to to the old site if we don't get it fixed. You can still use the old site at this address: http://www.aws.org/w/s/

You don't have to register for the new site. It's optional, if you want to customize the home page to your own interests, but there is no requirement.  (If you could customize it without registering, we would do that, but the server has to recognize you to remember your preferences.)

Nobody wants to shove anything down your throat.  The old site had fallen down below Hobart, EWI, and welding.com on Google, and now we are on top in just a few days. We are just trying to bring more people into our fold, and also there are a lot of great news stories about what welders are doing in their communities and what is happening in welding technology. We do offer a huge amount of fresh news and articles (thousands) that were never available before, anywhere.

Let me know what you liked so much about the old website, please!  This new one is a work in progress, and we have built a technological infrastructure that will just get better (and prettier) in the future. We will always have a link on the home page to the hottest forum topic of the day, which we never had before. And forum threads of interest to particular welding specialists will be put into the news items for people who have expressed those preferences.

So we now have a customizable website that can be relevant to the very diverse world of welders. Some who work in plants, some who work in construction, students, engineers, inspectors, sales people, etc. etc. We need to be all things to all people, and this customizable technology is the foundation for that.

So suggestions are invited. That's what this forum is all about. Speaking of the forum, we are upgrading soon to allow direct posting of pictures within the forum. Also, we are unifying the forum registration with the website registration (one login). This is hard, but we need to do it.  Also, we are trying to put a window on the home page that shows the most recent forum postings. This will build more forum traffic and liven things up even more. There will be bugs, but I'm sure I'll hear about them right away.

Remember how messed up this forum was a year ago? Give it a month, guys!

Thanks for your comments.  Keep 'em coming!

Ross
AWS Marketing
Parent - - By jon20013 (*****) Date 01-03-2007 15:42
I gotta take my hat off to you, Ross.  Good explanation.  One thing in particular I don't like about the new site (and it may only be me) is it's just BORING to look at; it's more like reading a newspaper than a website.  Aside from the navigational problems I suppose it may be okay.  I admit the forum has improved in the past 6 months or so... Get John Wright his 5-stars that he's been waiting on for the past 3 months, lol!
Parent - - By ross (***) Date 01-03-2007 17:34
OK, John has his well-deserved five stars now. Also, we just fixed the Internet Explorer bug, and I will add more ways to get to the forums.

Ross
Parent - - By jon20013 (*****) Date 01-03-2007 17:42
Thanks Ross!  Happy New Year to you!  Man, does that 5-Star General shine!!!  Wooo-Hooo!!!
Parent - By jwright650 (*****) Date 01-03-2007 22:00
You guys are embarrassing me.... :-) with this attention to the five star stuff.
Parent - By old-N-ugly (*) Date 01-04-2007 01:11
As I see it; If a welder was paid the salary of a basketball player this page would not have so many hits.. just my millions :lol
Parent - By TimGary (****) Date 01-04-2007 15:31
I like the new setup...
I never really used the old one for anything as I have a direct shortcut to the forum. There just wasn't anything there to catch my interest enough to repeatedly go back to it.
Now that I have customized the current page to fit my interests, I've added it to my favorites for daily viewing.
It's not very "flashy", but who cares? It's the raw data that creates the purpose anyway. All that extra fluff just increses the download time on a dial up system, which I'm still stuck with at work :( .
Now if you could just get rid of those darn advertisements I'd be really happy!
I like the improvements to the forum as well. I'm real glad to hear your going to start allowing pics!
Keep up the good work Ross!

Tim Gary
Parent - - By pipewelder_1999 (****) Date 01-03-2007 15:40
I like pages with more text less pictures. Other than that, the format means nothing. The look appears to be similar to others. I have not been able to log in and have yet to figure that out.

The information content hasn't changed it seems. I like the information available on some of the other sites such as TWI, Ukwelder etc. The hobart forum layout is miles above this in my opinion howver I would not change anything if it meant loosing the archives for this forum.

Gerald
Parent - - By RonG (****) Date 01-03-2007 16:11
Same here. I try to log in but it tells me to get lost in so many words. Really hurt my feelings too. I used the same log in I do on this Forum. Is that not the correct log in required?
Parent - By Cgregory (**) Date 01-03-2007 16:15
Unfortunately, right now you can't use your forum log in for the AWS website log in.

What you need to do is create a new log in for the AWS website, and from that point, go ahead and customize the new website to fit your interests.
Parent - - By Cgregory (**) Date 01-03-2007 16:22
Ok, here's what I did when I was playing with the site up in New England during my vacation.  (It was raining!)

I went to the "Please register as a guest" link at the top of the page.  That brought me to "New Guest Account."  I put in one of my e-mail addresses, put in a fake name, and put in passwords. Since I was using a friend's computer, I did NOT use the "Log me in automatically" command since I didn't want cookies put into his computer.

This brought me to the next page which says "Welcome to the Wide World of Welding!" After a few seconds, this defaulted to the main page which now says "My AWS." In the top right hand corner it said "Hi Karen!" (the fake name used.)  And from there I was able to customize my interests.
Parent - - By RonG (****) Date 01-03-2007 16:38
But my name's not Karen :-).

Thank you. Who ever you are.
Parent - - By Cgregory (**) Date 01-03-2007 16:44
You can use whatever name you wish :)

I already had an account under my actual name Christine, which is why I had to create a fake one.
Parent - By Lawrence (*****) Date 01-03-2007 17:01
Right

Since I don't have my AWS membership number committed to memory I tried to use the function to get my numbers by entering my name and zipcode, this told me that there were multiple users with my name and address.... sure

Just another bug I suppose.

Good luck with all this you techies.

I hope your next project is making the AWS Technical, Code Committee and subcommittee websites usable. "Christine has my laundry list of tech gripes on that score"
Parent - - By jon20013 (*****) Date 01-03-2007 16:58
Hey!  Karen is my wife!!!  :)
Parent - By Cgregory (**) Date 01-03-2007 17:01
I did not know that!
Parent - - By jon20013 (*****) Date 01-03-2007 17:01
You are one sick, sick puppy Christine... Working on your vacation!  lol!
Parent - - By RonG (****) Date 01-03-2007 18:25
Yea!
I managed to get logged in, they tell me it's a bug in the system. Christine isn't the you are of expertise?
Parent - - By Cgregory (**) Date 01-03-2007 18:28
You're logged into the main webpage, right? What bug are you seeing?
Parent - - By RonG (****) Date 01-03-2007 18:36
Forgive me for being a yo-yo. I know you take the your editing seriously but I was referring to your altered ego (microbiologist). Talk about multi tasking!
Parent - By Cgregory (**) Date 01-03-2007 18:45
:: grins :: It does take some head switching -- but so far I have successfully kept all discussions of microbes in the Florida mangrove ecosystems OFF the AWS website.
Parent - By Cgregory (**) Date 01-03-2007 19:20
Oh, and yes, I suppose you could say I study "bugs" -- but years of microbiology training has trained me out of using those terms unless they're deliberately called to my attention :)  Especially since I know absolutely nothing about insects.

But enough about my biology interests -- back to chatting about welding where I get to learn stuff from you guys.
Parent - - By yorkiepap (***) Date 01-03-2007 18:49
Hey Al,
I gotta agree with you on this one. I simply bookmarked this page from the start and just come here. I find it so irritating that the "bugs" have to be worked out. Why can't anyone in the computer realm completely test a system before instituting and creating constant issues of reliability and functionality? Just went thru all the "debugging" with the phone company reorganization recently on their "new" website.....and I did send them more than one "expletive" letter.....finally after 3 months...works somewhat.

We heard promises regarding the avatar feature before the end of '06......STILL WAITING!!!!!!!!!!

Keep ranting.....it's healthy......Denny
Parent - By ross (***) Date 01-03-2007 19:17
We're not talking about avatars, which were not a priority of the users, as far as I know (we currently have the feature turned off). We're talking about easily posting pictures of welds, fixtures, rigs, etc. without having to use an external picture site.  That opens our server to files that people can upload and it is a security issue that has to be done right, but we are going to do it soon - it'll be very useful, I think.

(If you want avatars, you can have those today.)

I hear you wanting features right away but also wanting them without bugs. We're trying!

Ross
Parent - - By RonG (****) Date 01-03-2007 20:05
Its not always bugs but just the fact the industry (software) grows and changes so fast no one is ever totally proficient with an application before it is replaced with the latest's and greatest .

I wasted a year of my life studying fortran. I can't even find any one who knows what it is.
Parent - - By Cgregory (**) Date 01-03-2007 20:49
Fortran = a scientific programming language that I had to take classes in during the 1980s along with PASCAL and BASIC.

I fear that this admission dates me badly :)  But I agree -- I've spent the rest of my life not using Fortran at all!
Parent - - By jon20013 (*****) Date 01-03-2007 21:05
I spent that same period of time drooling over wanting to learn it but never had the opportunity nor the time.  Back then FORTRAN was for the big kids and offered a whole new realm of possibilities, how come it became obscure?
Parent - - By eekpod (****) Date 01-03-2007 21:39
Nothing like the good old BASIC program.   "IF then> go to"  I used to be able to make my screen flash black and white, that's about all I could get it to do.  Does this post make me look old? LOL I hope not. Chris
Parent - - By jon20013 (*****) Date 01-03-2007 21:48
Not at all.  I remember my very first comp., back around 1980... can't remember it had something like a grand total of 8 megs or something... rigged it up to the TV set for a monitor, lol... it worked!
Parent - By hogan (****) Date 01-03-2007 22:31
my first was a trs-80. all the stuff i did on that over a couple of years, i could now do in half of a hour
Parent - - By ross (***) Date 01-03-2007 22:31
Not 8 megs; in the early 80's it would have been just 8 kilobytes. Really.

Ross
Parent - By jon20013 (*****) Date 01-04-2007 06:29
Ahhh, you are correct Ross, kilobytes, lol... showing a bit of dating myself, lol!
Parent - - By RANDER (***) Date 01-03-2007 22:43
And used tapes to record to instead of those really cool BIG floppys
Parent - - By chris2698 (****) Date 01-04-2007 05:09
I like the old site more this one S*CKS I couldn't find the forum I do sometimes read the articles but i just like the other more. I said I didn't like change well not true I do like change on somethings but this isn't one of them. I will do the same and just add the forum address to my favorites.

Chris
Parent - By ross (***) Date 01-04-2007 12:33
You can still reach the old home page at http://www.aws.org/w/s/.  What's the best thing about the old home page?

Ross
Parent - - By billvanderhoof (****) Date 01-04-2007 08:20
Fortran- a contraction of the words formula translation.  It was invented by IBM in the 60s in an attempt allow programming by end users rather than programmer techies.  I learned it on an IBM 1620, that may have been the machine it was originally written for but it was quickly made available for many (most?) other machines.  A 1620 had 20000 (expandable to 60000) decimal digits of memory (decimal arithmetic to avoid confusing the uninitiated I guess).  It took two digits to represent a character so you could relate this to 10K bytes.  Input/output with tab cards or paper tape.  Later the school got a model 2 machine with a disc drive, 5 megs or so on a device the size of a washing machine that cost as much as a house (really).  A moderate desk top machine today would probably outperform all the computer machinery installed on the earth in the early 1960's.

Fortran still has it's fans.  You can get a compiler (free) from GNU.

Enough rambling from the old guy, who is really showing his age.
Bill
Parent - - By RonG (****) Date 01-04-2007 15:17
I am not surprised to find old Fortran users here. Back in its day it was the best tool around but I am really not that old I just took it up for a hobby. 

Was that a bolt of lighting I just seen?
Parent - - By jon20013 (*****) Date 01-04-2007 20:56
Okay Christine or Ross, run this past us one more time: yesterday I went to log onto the website using the same login name and password as I use for the Forum.  Invalid.  I tried using my e-committee's login name and password.  Invalid.  Please let us know what we have to do to establish the login name and password so we can repeatedly come back to the website without having to enter member number and postal code...
Parent - - By Cgregory (**) Date 01-04-2007 20:58
Right now, you can't log into the website with the same user name and password that you use on the forums. What you can do is log in with your membership number and password, or do what I did -- register with an e-mail address and a password.  Then you can use that e-mail address to log on to the website.
Parent - - By jon20013 (*****) Date 01-04-2007 21:19
Need to get that fixed.  I have no password for my membership number, is that meant to be my postal code???  Am not going to register with an e-mail address and password.
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