Fit up problems with A252 pipe

By hogan

Date 04-24-2007 18:40

would A53 apply? it lists a + or - of 1% for D over 2"

By Bob Garner (***)

Date 04-24-2007 18:47

Unfortunately, A53 only goes up to 26" diameter. We're looking for pipe for pipe piles to be driven to support some over-water piers. The pipes will have to be butt-spliced from random lengths to get the lengths we need. We may need 48" diameter or possibly 60" diameter.

Thanks for the reply,

Bob

By js55

Date 04-24-2007 19:20

Not sure what the question is however virtually any out of roundness can be fit to almost any tolerance provided the diameter of the two joints is the same. Its a matter of how hard the material is, much money you want to spend on port-a-powers, how much time you wanna spend fitting them, and how much of a tolerance engineering will allow to maintain structural integrity

By js55

Date 04-24-2007 19:23

I guess another way of putting this is that if there is no material tolerance for roundness in 252, then you have two choices. You can impose a toelrance based upon other specs, but this would incure added cost and delivery times even if the manufacturer would comply, which is doubtful, or you can have engineering determine what tolerances are exceptable and fit to that.

By Bob Garner (***)

Date 04-24-2007 22:37

Let's see if this photo posts O.K. It shows the fit up problem.

Bob

By ssbn727 (*****)

Date 04-25-2007 00:10 Edited 04-25-2007 00:15

Hi Bob!

I think you're gonna have to step back a bit so we can see how the pipe joint looks with the 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 and nine O'clock positions in order to see where all of the High-low locations are below the 3 & 9 O'clock positions... If you have to take more than one pic from different angles, then you might just be able to display most if not - all of the High-Low locations and any out of roundness.

Have you contacted Mathey Dearman yet??? These folks make some really nice pipe fitting tools for any size pipe... Here's their website: http://www.mathey.com/

Here's some tools that may be of assistance depending on your budget constraints:
http://www.mathey.com/documents/MDCatalog2005.pdf

Here is the webpage that links you to all of their .pdf's:
http://www.mathey.com/products.htm

Commercial pipe sizes: http://www.mathey.com/documents/Commerical PipeSizes.pdf

Here's a "Mega" rim clamp manual: http://www.mathey.com/documents/RimClampManual.pdf
Here's the "Mega" rim clamp catalog: http://www.mathey.com/documents/megarimclamp.pdf
Here's the Rim clamp catalog: http://www.mathey.com/documents/RimClamp.pdf

I would suggest for you to contact them in order for them to completely understand your specific application because I'm sure that they can come up with the right tools for your job. You also may want to ask if there is a possibility for you to rent any of their standard (if applicable) type clamps instead of purchasing (I doubt it but, one never knows until one asks!) as an option. Oh yeah - I almost forgot, you better grind down/ inspect those tack welds perpendicular to the pipe joint and clean up the base metal oxidation within the bevels before you weld otherwise you'll have some problems later on. Just a suggestion based on best practices -that's all!

BTW, I do not work for them nor do I sell their products however, I have used their products in the past and consider them excellent equipment for use on pipe & tubing.
Respectfully,
Henry

By JTMcC

Date 04-25-2007 02:39

Yes it's familiar and if you have experienced Pile Driver/Welders splicing your pile they will know how to deal with it. Are your welders on site yet?
Pile that size will need some reforming and a common way is with dogs and wedges (or jacks), experienced hands can do that with a relatively small number of wedges and in a short amount of time. Unexperienced hands can end up chasing the out of round condition for quite some time.
If you've got experienced hands they'll also know what methods are acceptable in your local.
If your welders are on site, and not dealing with the out of round effectively then you have a bigger problem and I'd suggest finding someone with experience dealing with large diameter heavy wall pipe splices to come in and show them the most efficient way to deal with it.

JTMcC.

By Bob Garner (***)

Date 04-25-2007 15:24

I greatly appreciate everyone's input and thank you all. The photo came from another contractor so I can't get any further details. A252 allows a diameter variance of 1% of the pipe diameter so a 48" pipe could be out of whack by almost 1/2". With two pipes butted together in the wrong position, that could be nearly an inch. So why doesn't the contractor just "clock" the pipes to align their out of round locations? I suspect the contractor may be working on a claim situation with the owner, who furnished the pipe for the piling.

I especially appreciated the leads on the tools to wrestle the pipes into correct alignment. I had forgotten that a good pipefitter who has the right tools can do anything. (I'm an engineer and I'm on this forum so I don't design somethin' stoopid that can't be built.) As I stated previously, I'm designing a pipe pile project for the Port of Long Beach. We are going to add a section in our specifications that the contractor shall provide means and methods of aligning the pipe as required to meet AWS requirements for butt joints, etc.

Again, thank you all.

Bob Garner