Certified Welding Inspector of the Year Award

By ctacker (****)

Date 12-01-2007 03:21

Looks like your the chairman of nothing Joe :)

By CWI555

Date 12-01-2007 04:35

I can't say as I understand that process. Nominating yourself for an award that is. If you need a nomination, there are several here worthy of it. Maybe a secret ballot via the forum. Could send nominations to you. I believe between the members of the forum, a name could be found.

By ctacker (****)

Date 12-01-2007 05:21

thats an idea, but being kinda new here, i dont know who is CWI and who isn't! and even some old timers here probably dont know who's educators, CWI's, Engineers or whatever they are!

By Joseph P. Kane (****)

Date 12-01-2007 14:39

CTacker, CWI555,

How do you know "there are several here worthy of it"? Because they are involved in the forum? How do you know what kind of an inspector they are? What one thing do they do as an inspector, that would make them a better inspector than the average inspector? Lots of knowledge does not necessarily make you a good inspector.

There is an established set of rules for the nomination and what is required in the nomination submission. The Subcommitee follows these rules very strictly, and the review of the nomination packages is very thorough. Deviation from the rules can often result in disqualification from consideration.

Please read the rules before you comment. My offer was for anyone who wanted to to submit themself for the award. I am not opening this string for debate on the rules or the merits of any individual who takes up the offer. Those subjects are handled by the AWS Certification Committee and the Selection Subcommittee, and are approved by the AWS Board of Directors. If you do not like those rules, apply to get on the AWS Certification Committee as a Volunteer. Pay for your own travel expenses, lodging, meals, Etc. for a few years, and go through the committee process to change the rules.

I recognize that "Self Praise Stinks", and you may feel embarassed putting yourself in for the award. If you were nominated by somoene else, you would still have to "blow your own horn," in order to supply the information necessary to win the selection process. As a regular nominee, the real honor is being nominated. All the required paperwork, and everything else that follows is a "Blow your own horn" contest. As a Pro-Se nominee, the honor is winning the contest for the award. If you are good, and you know it, shout it loud and proud and let a committee of your peers evaluate your submission. Lets face it! Only you know why you are better than someone else! I assure you, if you get selected, you will really deserve this prestigious award. If you do not get selected, it could mean that you are not deemed worthy OR your submission packet was not worthy. ( We will not tell you.)

The Subcommitttee does not reveal why one person or the other does not get selected. Often, nominations are disqualified because the nomination packet does not have the required signature. (Hey - We are CWIs and we require everyone we inspect, to cross their Eyes and dot their Tees, so why wouldn't the CWI of the Year Nominee be expected to pay attention to smallest detail in the rules.)

We have a very comprehensive evaluation checklist. It was written to eliminate the vauge subjectivity often associated with a selection process. We will not just give this award out to anyone at all, just because we do not have regular nominees from the Section and District Nominating Committees.

I am not begging for nominations. I am perfctly willing to report that "The CWI of the Year Award Selection Subcommittee believes that there were no worthy nominees this year"! (We have done it once before when we did have regular nominees!) I am just making an offer to extend the deadline for submission until 1 January 2008, to readers in the Forum.

Joe Kane

By CWI555

Date 12-01-2007 17:59

Joe,

It was a simple observation not based on any specific knowledge level, but rather their approach to specific questions that have been ask. I can throw a pile a books at someone, or that someone could be very well educated already, but as you say it's not a promise of being a good inspector. That knowledge has to be utilized properly with ethics and a proper approach to a given problem. There are some who are very very knowledgable with experience, but apply it in an unethical manner, and yet others, who know the books but can't apply a proper approach for lack of hands on experience.

Awards I've recieved in my career did not in any case come from nominating myself, nor will they ever. Even though times have changed since my Grandfathers time, one bit of wisdom he passed to me still holds true for the most part. He who has to ask for a raise, probably doesn't deserve it, and if your working for a company that just doesn't recognize excellence over stupidity and laziness, staying with that company means your stupid to.

I was simply trying to help, I appologize if that attempt offended, but i make no apology for what I believe. People can take that or leave it, it's their choice.

Regards,
Gerald

By Joseph P. Kane (****)

Date 12-01-2007 19:12 Edited 12-03-2007 18:24

CWI555

My turn to apologize. I did not mean to sound offended.

I am always offended at false modesty. I nominated the second and third CWIs of the Year. The Third one gave me the modesty routine and made it difficult to get information to put in the nomination packet. As District Nominating Chairman, I put a lot of time and effort into that nomination packet. To me, there was some second hand honor in getting the award for someone.

As I said, the real honor is when your AWS Section nominates you. Then, the real work begins. The war stories have to be put together and made into good reasons the nominee was greater than the average CWI. Individual accomplishments are told best in the first person singular. That means bragging. Any pretence otherwise is false modesty. That is much much worse than bragging. The only difference when you nominate yourself, is that the honor is yours after you get the award.

Really, if you read the rules and you think you are of the caliber, "Shout it loud and Proud", and get to work. Don't worry about what others think. Of course, some other forum members are on the Selection Committee, so put your best foot forward but do not lie or over-exxagerate.

Joe Kane

By CWI555

Date 12-01-2007 22:39

I appreciate what your saying, and understand where your coming from. However; I believe we'll have to agree to disagree on the value of bragging.

Respectfully,
Gerald

By ssbn727 (*****)

Date 12-02-2007 08:04

Hi Joe!
C'mon now Joe!!! What's with the faulty grammar??? "was greate than the average CWI."
Gotta keep you on your toes there champ!!! ;) :) :)

Respectfully,
Henry

By Lawrence (*****)

Date 12-02-2007 13:07

SSBN

Diddn't your dad ever tell you:;

"Don't poke the bear!"

By ssbn727 (*****)

Date 12-03-2007 04:20

Hey Larry!

My Dad was the Bear! ;)
Besides, I've known Joe Kane since the early eighties so, I believe I'm qualified to "poke the Bear" so to speak.
If you really know Joe like I do, you would know that he's really a "Teddy" instead of a Grizzly!!!
He just does'nt like any BS - PERIOD!

In any event, how are your students doing?

Respectfully,
Henry

By Lawrence (*****)

Date 12-03-2007 11:10

Hey Bear Poker!

The semester is almost over....... I don't know where it went.

Students are a mystery...... Much talent... Hard to get them to recognize it and put it into action. Consitsant on time attendence is a bigger issue this semester than the last few.... Looking to work in more motivation///// Apparently all those good jobs out there aren't motivation enough....go figure.

By ssbn727 (*****)

Date 12-04-2007 05:11

Hi Larry!

I hear you loud and clear!!!
This new generation of potential welder/fabricators want everything handed to them for the most part! :(
However there are a few good ones out there although not enough, to fill all those good jobs. there's a disease out there that has poisoned the minds of our youth these days!!!

I call it "Instantgratificationitis" It has a profound symptom which causes most youngsters today to want everything handed to them!!! Another symptom is that they become extremely allergic to Hard work, and consistent attendance. ;( Fortunately there are some treatments available for this condition! ;) There are other symptoms but,I'll just stick to these two.

One of the treatments I use often is called: "Rolemodelfication" and, giving them their daily dosage of
"Winnersalwaysfollwthroughwiththeirresponsibilities" "Honorisearned", "Integritymustbeworkedat" "IdonottakeanycraporBS", "Getyouracttogetherorgetout"... I then reinforce their feelings with:
"Iwillbeyourbiggestfanifyougivemearealeffort", "Travellingthenationwiththisskill" with anther dose of "Makingmoremoneythanflippingburgers" and "Stopyou'rewhining' in appropriate situations.

There are new treatments being developed as I write, and I'm optimistic that they will also become helpful in motivating the younger students to achieve to the best of their abilities instead of just existing in the background, and eventually becoming one of those long prison numbers that they will be recognized as such.

Respectfully,
Henry

By CWI555

Date 12-06-2007 19:59

Sounds like a new medical dictionary needs to be written

By ctacker (****)

Date 12-01-2007 18:50

Joe, I never said "there are several here worthy of it" i said "its an idea", I also said that me being new around here i don't know who is who and i should have said I wouldn't vote or nominate anyone because i don't know who is worthy it. and I agree with Gerald that if you need to blow your own horn you Probably don't deserve it anymore than the next guy!

If someone else were to nominate anyone,it would at least show your recognized by someone other than yourself! and where i come from, that means alot more than nominating yourself. CWI's are mostly derived from welders, and i have met few who didn't think they were the best, and they clearly were no better than the mediocre!

By Joseph P. Kane (****)

Date 12-01-2007 23:55

Carl

I fully understand that a third party nomination would be ideal. However, the circumstances do not allow time enough for the normal nomination process. If you were involved in your local AWS Section, or your District Structure, you would know more about the award process.

I have gotten three people this award before I became Chairman of the Selection Subcommittee. I know that self promotion is almost unavoidable if you want to get the award. I have lots of experience getting people awards. The only real honor is in the nomination. It is a National Award, and there is usually a lot of competition for it. The rules and the selection criteria are written to prevent subjective elements and personal prejudices from swaying the selection subcommittee.

Self nomination isn't as nice as being nominated by a third party, but so What?

By Jim Hughes (***)

Date 12-06-2007 13:25

Does it have to be a AWS CWI? I have some great ASNT-TC-1A Level II inspectors. They are certified welding inspectors. 5 out of the 8 that I'm speaking of are some of the best I have ever seen. 7 out of the 8 started in the Nuclear industry back in the eighties. Great shop and field inspectors. Don't have to hold their hand. I can send all of them to do a vendor inspection for D1.1, ASME, API and don't have to worry about the quality of their work. Excellent reporting skills. Part of our ASNT program is training in technical writing.

Thanks
Jim

By 803056

Date 12-06-2007 14:53

Can I laugh now or do I have to wait for Joe's reply?

Al

By Jim Hughes (***)

Date 12-06-2007 17:05

What's to laugh about?

Jim

By Joseph P. Kane (****)

Date 12-06-2007 20:48

I have to exercise a lot of self restraint here making this reply.

"YES" It does have to be an AWS CWI.

By ctacker (****)

Date 12-06-2007 21:51

Come on Joe, I was looking forward to your reply!

By Joseph P. Kane (****)

Date 12-06-2007 22:41 Edited 12-07-2007 01:03

Sorry, I was grinding my teeth so hard, my gnashing fangs broke!

By Jim Hughes (***)

Date 12-06-2007 23:06

So then ctacker was correct then!! you are the chairman of nothing:)

Jim

P.S
I think you were trying in your CWI kind of way to spell teeth (teth).

By Joseph P. Kane (****)

Date 12-07-2007 01:06

Thank you for pointing out my spelling error.

By Jim Hughes (***)

Date 12-07-2007 12:51

Thank you for not being "flippant and condescending" with your replies to my post.:)

Jim

By Shane Feder (****)

Date 12-08-2007 15:14

Greetings everyone from the Philippines,
I am afraid I will have to side with Gerald on this one.
In my opinion to be eligible for any award in anything in life you should be nominated by your peers, the idea that someone could think themselves the best CWI in the country does not sit very well with me.
I am sorry if I offend anyone with this statement but braggarts are people I loathe and believe me I have met quite a few over the years. If you added up all the projects they had been on they would be about 200 years old.
Allowing the contest to be open to self-nominees opens it up to ridicule.
I can just imagine (hypothetically) I won the award, and I happened to be on a major power station outage / shutdown with 10 other CWIs and they new that I may (or may not) have nominated myself, I would be the laughing stock of the job. Nobody likes anyone with a big head who thinks they are better than others.
Joe, I think it is a great idea what you are doing but self-nomination sucks,
Regards,
Shane

By Joey

Date 12-08-2007 16:57 Edited 12-08-2007 17:00

Hi Shane

Kip vs Vonash

Its either one them only.

I will bet for 1 case of San Miguel Beer

Enjoy your stay in Phillipines, I tried a lot of Balot when I was in Batangas, its good for memory.

Cheers
Joey

By CWI555

Date 12-08-2007 20:57

Shane,

afraid to is it? :)

Out of curiosity, you on vacation or business in the PI? Haven't been there in some time, be interested in hearing of any changes there lately.

Regards,
Gerald

By Shane Feder (****)

Date 12-09-2007 02:17

Hi Gerald / Joey,
Working in Batangas at the moment. CB&I are building us some Duplex storage tanks for the Nickel Refinery I am working on in New Caledonia so I am over here looking after them for the client.
A Korean company have just opened a US$1.7 billion shipyard in Subic Bay and they reckon they are going to need 20,000 workers (mostly welders) by 2010 so it could be pretty busy up this way for a while.
I have fallen in love with Tanduay rum but don't mention balot to me, just the sight / smell is enough for me without eating it. They say it gives you strong knees but I am quite happy with the ones I have got,
All the best,
Shane

By CWI555

Date 12-09-2007 02:26 Edited 12-09-2007 02:31

as I recall, the balut is duck egg with a half developed duck in it (near wholey developed at times). I had the same assessment of it, it's rather disgusting isn't it?
I'll pass on any "benifit" from eating it. My wife is from Manila, she has tried to get me to eat that crap more than once.

Regards,
Gerald

By Joseph P. Kane (****)

Date 12-09-2007 02:34

Shane

If you were the nominations chairman in an AWS Section or an AWS District, and you had to come up with a nominee for the CWI of the Year Award, the one easy way to do it, would be to recommend someone you knew from your associations at the meetings. You would have known this person was a CWI and he was involved in weld inspection through listening to his war stories over the years.

Now, those war stories are really minor bragging episodes. To you they are stories you could use as a source to begin writing up a list of accomplishments to write up for the nomination submission packet. Now, if you knew all the first hand facts about these stories, it would be ideal. Most likely, you would not have ever known about these war stories unless you had heard him telling them

So, I submit that the person you listened to over the years, has been tooting his own horn for all these years. His bragging was the source of the information. Unknowingly he was aiding the nomination by telling these stories. It is a small thing to tell small war stories. However, it is considered bragging if the person would sit down in one session and tell the same stories for the purposes of getting an award?!?!

It is also important to note that the AWS CWI of the Year is not necessarily the one and only greatest CWI on earth. He/She is just the best of the nominations considered that year. If ten other CWIs on your project are green with envy - GREAT! Let them laugh! You have the award - They don't! HA!

I don't see them contributing on the Forum, and they are probably not involved in Section or District or other AWS Volunteer Committee activities!

Another thing - If you are a CWI and you don't think that you yourself are the greatest, then you are mediocre at best. You owe some improvement to the profession!

Well, maybe not really! But you should think enough of yourself and the profession to constantly improve and be at your best all the time on the job. You should think enough of yourself to believe that you deserve the award if you were nominated for it by someone else! I would hope that you would at least help your nomination chairman get your package together in a manner that accentuates your accomplishments without lying. I would hope that you wouldn't put on the phony modesty routine and pretend it was beneath you to hype your own accomplishments.

Joe Kane

By Shane Feder (****)

Date 12-09-2007 11:16

" Another thing - If you are a CWI and you don't think that you yourself are the greatest, then you are mediocre at best. You owe some improvement to the profession! "

Joe,
I am not going to let this degenerate into a slanging match, I respect you and I respect what you are trying to do. I just do not agree with self nomination.
I think I was a damn good pipewelder for a lot of years and I think I am a damn good CWI but the only way to judge that is by my ability to stay employed. If I am constantly ringing or e-mailing companies looking for work then I am obviously not a very good pipewelder or CWI, if my phone is constantly ringing with offers of employment then I would consider myself a good welder or inspector. In 30 years of short term construction work I have never been unemployed for more than 5 days.
I have listened to and told numerous "war stories" over the years, I have worked in places as diverse as Outback Australia to the jungles of Papua New Guinea, but I fail to see the relevance of "war stories" to being judged " CWI of the Year".
I may have been on a project with a 99% repair rate or a project with a 0% repair rate, is that anything to do with my ability ?. It is more to do with the incompetence or competence of the contractor.
I have been on numerous projects where I am the most hated person on site (by the contractor), I "discover" things which were not meant to be "discovered".
The true test of how good you are is your relationship with the clients and the contractors, if the clients love you and the contractors hate you then you know you are doing your job.
Welding Inspection is not about a popularity contest, if I sit down at a conference table and the contractors Project Manager looks across at me as if he would like to jump the table and strangle me then I know I am doing my job.
Why not e-mail your major oil refineries, nuclear plants, power stations and other major industry players and ask them to nominate a CWI, that would be a truer reflection of who is CWI of the Year than someone going " pick me because I'm the best".
Regards,
Shane

By jon20013 (*****)

Date 12-10-2007 11:02

Joe;

Having known you for now nearly 20 years... (God, where does time go???) I can, with all honesty, say you are the most dilligent and morale CWI I've ever known. I think, in reading this thread, you have gone above and beyond your duties as Chair. That said, I know you'd like to have someone to submit but if no one is forthcoming I'd just let it go... as you say, you're now "begging" for applicants and should have no need to explain your duties and desires and Committee Chair. Good job, too bad for those who may be deserving.

By Shane Feder (****)

Date 12-10-2007 14:48

Jon,
I have never met Joe or yourself but you and I have spent a lot of time conversing via the internet (both on and off the forum) over the years and I have enjoyed not only your knowledge but also your friendship.
My posting is/was purely to express my distaste at someone saying they are the best at something, surely the only way to gauge that is via your peers.
I agree with what you are saying that if you can't find a worthy candidate then perhaps it is better not to award it just because it was at short notice.
Hope I haven't ruffled too many feathers.
How is everything going in " GodnoeswherethehelliamisTan" ?
Cheers,
Shane

By Joseph P. Kane (****)

Date 12-10-2007 18:00

Jon, Shane

I am not begging for a nominee. I am defending the position that self nomination is not so strange when you consider how you would get the nomination through the regular Section and District process. The only difference is that the self nominee has to get up and say the words "Pick Me". The actual horn tooting is the same for both nominees.

Remember, we have a rather lengthly checklist, and even if you did self nominate, you had better have a good submission packet. (40 to 100 pages of exhibits) The rules have expanded since you were at AWS, Jon. Much more detail is required and the Selection Subcommittee uses a checklist. It is now takes a lot of work to participate on that Subcommittee. The problem is that no-one on the Forum has bothered to download and read the rules. It is a tough award to get. Just a self nomination would not be enough. If the forum CWIs would read the rules, maybe they could submit another person as their personal nominee, or get another person to nominate them. If they read the rules, they would realize that when and IF they got the award through a self nomination process, they would have earned it, and they would deserve it! Everyone is letting their sense of decorum dismiss the idea before investigating it's merits!!!

In all likelyhood the Main Committee will choose an Awardee. I was just trying to get the word out for a new venue.

On the personal side Jon, - twenty years - amazing! I didn't think of it. Damn - Now I'm a senior flatulent!!

Joe Kane

By tab_1999 (**)

Date 12-10-2007 19:02

Everyone should take a look, back at the posts from the start!
It appears that there is a lot of history, unintentional tooting, I'd say its just the type of information that the
AWS chair seeks.

It is a shame that as tight as the regular posters are here, ( some that have communicated on this site for several years with teach other )
there isn't several nominations made from affiliation alone, not to mention the helpful information that you guys all post and
strive to resolve.

I hope you all achieve that status someday. ( maybe everyone will work together in the future and learn each others work ethics and contributions and submit those that deserve)

There is no shortcut to anyplace worth going!

By Bill M

Date 12-11-2007 14:12

I'd like to know if Mr. Chuck Meadows was a CWI. If so...I'd like to nominate him.

By dbigkahunna (****)

Date 12-12-2007 00:42

I agree.
BABRT's

By Shane Feder (****)

Date 12-12-2007 08:45

I agree,
The amount of knowledge Chuck shared with us and the valuable assistance he gave to a lot of us would have made him an ideal candidate (if he was a CWI)
Regards,
Shane

By CWI555

Date 12-12-2007 17:23

Joe,

"Another thing - If you are a CWI and you don't think that you yourself are the greatest, then you are mediocre at best. You owe some improvement to the profession! "

I have always been taught to never think your better than someone else. To say that if you don't think your the greatest is being mediocre is patently wrong in my opinion.

I have absolutely no doubts as to my abilities, but I also know that no matter how good you think you are, there is always someone better, and someone worse.

I don't owe a damn thing to the "profession" for not nominating myself, the lack of self nomination, does not make me mediocre, as can be attested to by my clients, and former employers.

Respecfully,
Gerald

By Joseph P. Kane (****)

Date 12-12-2007 18:12

You should go back and read the paragraph after "Another thing - If you are a CWI and you don't think that you yourself are the greatest, then you are mediocre at best. You owe some improvement to the profession! " You can see that I backed off somewhat.

However, I also agree with your statement;- for the most part. Greatest is a poor choice of words for what I was trying to communicate.

You are right about "I also know that no matter how good you think you are, there is always someone better, and someone worse. "

By Joseph P. Kane (****)

Date 12-27-2007 01:42

To anyone interested in nominating him / herself for the CWI of the year award.

The last day for self nominations is 12-31-07. If you are interested, contact me as soon as possible.

Joe Kane