Dear all,
I would like to know what's the meaning "STANDARD TEST PIPES" described at the item 2 table 4.2 from AWS D1.1.
For example if I've machined a forged piece to the pipe standard dimensions, can I consider like a "Standard Pipe"?? Or in this case I must consider a "JOB SIZE PIPE"?
Thanks!
To answer your question about standard test pipes, standard test pipes are schedule 40 (standard), schedule 80 (extra strong), and schedule 120 (double extra strong), with each one having a different wall thickness. All three are associated with the ASTM A53 standard.
I'm not 100% sure about the job size test pipes. Though, I think it refers to a job specific pipe size. Just be aware that there's quite a difference in qualification ranges between job size test pipes and standard test pipes.
I would think that if you're considering subjecting your forged piece to standard pipe testing, it would at least have to meet the dimensions and the properties criteria, as well as the yield and tensile properties of A53, which has a min yield of 35 ksi and a min tensile of 60 ksi.
Have you consulted the EOR to see if this is acceptable to him/her before you proceed?
SCOTTN, thanks for your attention!
I understand that standard pipes are in accordance to ASTM standards, but if you look at the table 4.2 from AWS D1.1 you will see that the qualification range for "JOB PIPE" is different to "STANDARD PIPE". So my ask is about it... I would like to make a STANDARD PIPE with another material and check if this purpose is acceptable. Because I can't to buy my material (S355J2G3) like a "STANDARD PIPE", but I can transform it.
I don't know if you've understood me, but to me it's better consider machined materials like to "STANDARD PIPE".
Thanks.
Have you consulted the EOR to see if this is acceptable to him/her before you proceed?
same doubt i had now, and relatively posted few days before. no one answer me,.. if no one understandable,why it is in standard table. making us confused. just remove the standard pipe qualification.
If I may be a bit more clear, it is my understanding that Scott is advising that you speak to the Engineer Of Record (EOR). That may be your Project Engineer, the Customer Engineer or a Welding Engineer assigned to the project. In many cases the Engineer Of Record may allow changes to what the applicable code dictates.
I respectfully point out that there may be some confusion on our end as both ASTM and AWS codes are being referenced. Which code is being called out in the project specifications or purchasing documents?
Speaking from my own experience and how I would rule given the information you have posted (and this is my opinion only, not based in any codes), Regardless of the wording in the code, I would not look favorably on testing performed on pipe or forgings other than that which is called out in the project specifications. Again, this is why the Engineer of Record should be consulted.
Sorry for reviving this topic, but I have the same doubt and it is not clarified to me yet.
I need to qualify a group II material with the range of qualification of standard pipe 8" sch 80.
Also I don't have access to buy nor have in stock any material API 5L X-52 or other pipe/tubing listed as group II.
If I make a pipe formed from a ASTM A572 Gr 50 plate with the exact dimensions of the pipe 8" sch 80, can I consider it as a 'standard pipe' from the table 9.10 (2015 edition)?
EOR contact is not possible. I need the true interpretation of the code in this case.
A "true interpretation" can come only via a technical inquiry, processed in accordance with Annex N. This will be most likely time consuming on the order of months to years.
I don't understand how you have the capacity to roll 8" schedule 80 into pipe out of plate and weld it complete, but you don't have the capacity to obtain a group 2 pipe or access the EOR for a determination.
In my opinion you need to get the pipe that applies to your procedure or Somebody needs to sign off on the change and be ready to live with the consequences.
I don't see a happy answer for you in D1.1 (maybe somebody else has a different outlook)
First, it isn't the code that is not understandable, it is trying to understand your English but I am not being condescending, just truthful. It is hard to know how to respond when we don't understand the question, have enough information, or understand your application to the stated code, if it was stated for our information. For the record, we are dealing with Table 9.10 in the 2015. You are obviously referring to an older edition of D1.1? But, if you want to class your material as an A53, why are you qualifying your WPS? It is preapproved if it actually meets A53. But then it doesn't because it is 'forged'.
Second, be careful. According to AISC and ASTM standard A53 'Standard' pipe sizes GENERALLY correspond to Schedule 40 but not always. But, Schedule 80 and 120 ARE NOT standard, they are X-Strong and XX-Strong (Don't confuse terms by calling them 'standard' just because they are common and used for many applications.). And, when you look at AISC 360 in the front where it gives you all the W, S, C, L and Pipe shapes with their dimensions and strengths, it shows the difference between the different classes. Now, without mine handy, it may not give you the 'schedule' (10, 20, 40, 80, 120) dimensions but it does give you theirs and you can look the other up and see how they compare.
BUT, this is not the application of 'Standard' in this case. Read on.
So, third, a machined part is not a pipe per ASTM A53 regardless of what dimensions you made it to. Part of ASTM A53 is the establishment of mechanical properties, alloys, manufacturing procedures, etc. Your part does not fit into A53 no matter what size it is. It is just a home made hollow part. Thus, it has no schedule designation because it is not A53 Pipe.
What to do with it? That is going to be up to your engineer. What part of the code applies? Ask the engineer. They can put it anywhere they want according to clause 1.4.1 of D1.1:2015. How about welder qualification? If it is under 24" in diameter then they need to be qualified to weld pipe and tube. Any steel material that falls into one of the normally accepted Groups of Pre-Approved Base Metals in Table 3.1 can be welded once they qualify on an A53 pipe or an A500 HSS per Table 9.13 and 9.14. So, if your machined round tube is of Pre-Approved material then it is good. Again, probably not, since it is forged.
Now to separate the "Standard Test Pipes" in Table 9.10 from "Standard" pipe size. For Standard testing according to Clause 9.14 and Table 9.10 you are given a choice of 4 sizes to perform your WPS Qualification for whatever reason you need to qualify the procedure. But, if you want a more specific WPS qualification because of the special materials and/or size and/or other conditions then you may use Job Size Pipes to perform the tests. In either case the Table gives you the number of tests to be performed and the resultant qualification range. The 'Standard' portion gives exact dimensions while the 'Job Size' portion gives you sizes of 2T, T/2, etc. The Table is dealing with Standard Pipe Grades that are included in Table 3.1 and fit into the Schedule dimensions of A53 pipe. The Job Size Test pipes would include materials and sizes not included in the Standard portion of the two Tables.
There are many terms that can cause confusion if you don't apply them in the correct way. 'Standard' can mean many things. In this case, a 'Standard' Test as opposed to a 'Special' Test which may need to be performed because of the materials used. Your Special test needs to utilize the Job Size Test Pipes since it is not a Standard grade of material acknowledged in Table 3.1.
He Is In Control, Have a Great Day, Brent
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